Warcraft II Forum
Wasteland => Flame Wars & Offtopic => Topic started by: MaStA{hR} on November 20, 2015, 09:14:16 PM
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There are always the arguments out there that pud players are always superior to custom players. In some if not most cases, that can be true. End of discussion. If you're not used to building and pud-style Unit Control you're going to suck at GoW, PoS, Rose Petal etc. The learning curve for puds is a lot greater. Certainly true. But, most pud players don't play custom maps, and when they do, they usually lose to a high tier custom player at their particular maps. This is also certainly true.
Paintball and other customs like AO, Chop etc. offer unique styles of game play that don't always translate from pud skill to custom skill. Contrary to what pud players think, they would NOT be a tier 1 customs player after 1 or even 100 games. However, there are particular players that have lasted throughout the War 2 eras that make up a different case. Please allow me to explain.
For example on a 5 tier paintball custom system (In no particular order):
Tier 1
xXxSmeagolxXx
MaStA{hR}
QUICK{hR}
PiRaTe{hR}
Tier 2
Flea
cLeTo
xCaL
kilaz_e_mastafu
$killa$Lancelot
Proof-Dealer
Crash3r
8)Mikulz(8
Tier 3
Evil~MANOWAR
TDK-Seedy
~Tora~
WarBandit
LordCaptainCook
Tier 4
Shanona413
ElmoDoesDrugs
Jessu0001
Tier 5
Tolist
gabrielrsrs
or other noobs
This is just an example.
Now, if you take most pud players, they would IMMEDIATELY fall into a tier 3 or high tier 4 roll, and probably rise to a tier 2 position in a week or two. To reach tier 2 in a pud, it could likely take a year or more of hard dedication. But, let's take Swift (Kyle) for example. An anomaly to the equation. He immediately falls into a low tier 2 position without having played a game. His war2 IQ is off the charts. He will forever be known as a top 5 player, and depending on who you ask, he is in the 1st-2nd of all-time discussion. Now, after about 1 week of playing paintball customs, he could easily rise into a lower tier 1 and irregularly beat the likes of Smeagol, QUICK, or myself. And with more practice after a small amount of time, we could see a more consistent .500.
This is just my 2 cents in comparing the two. I think custom play is valuable and the skills are different. I want to pay a tribute to all sides. I wouldn't mind including more players on my relative paintball tier system, but I can't think of any more players at the moment.
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Sounds pretty accurate. I played tk in pball 6 times, and then beat Flea 2-0 and went 2-4 with Cleto and 1-2 with Medivh. So yes, it's easier to be good at pball (5 games practice and already Tier 2). And I'm not even tier 2 at BNEs :P
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I will make you out a more accurate version of this(though this is pretty good). I have notebooks with 'bracket' and standings and such. I also have played with many many PBallers. I'll post it sometime tomorrow probably a standings and tier system post.
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We're all going to have our own opinions. Your four tier system doesn't provide enough difference in types of skill level. You put too many average players at the top.
Tier 1 should literally have like 3 people in it.
Think about GoW.
Tier 1
Ash
Swift
Virus
Tier 2
Shotgun
Poscow
Tier 3
Braviet
Tyrus
Yamon
Skipping around now
Tier 5-6
AA.Goblin
Tier 6
Masta{hR}
Tier 9
Smeagol
Tier 10
Tolist
If you notice... and I don't know how much you know about the GoW community, but someone like Tyrus is godly. You can go orc, and he can go human archers, and he will still spank you inside of 5 minutes. Myself as well. If you use your paintball tier system comparatively, you are throwing someone like Tyrus in the same conversation with swift. That's a huge no no, unless you openly admit that custom maps don't require much skill thus it's too difficult to see variance in skill. Then I might just switch to pud play.
You literally insult yourself and the likes of me by lumping certain players in the conversation as us. You are essentially saying they deserve a legacy by winning a couple of tournaments in 1 low turnout paintball season of probably 45 man map tourneys. I watched their 60 man play... it's literally how we played in 2002. Their switch strategies no longer work. I could ctrl + patrol rush and beat him at start. Please, if you want to make a tier system, at least think about it, otherwise you give players like blid fuel to their fire that custom players blow donkey dick. If I am equal to xcaL, 8)Mikulz(8, Proof-Dealer, Adam-w, Cs-Kirby, and Murd0ck then this game sucks. You can't compare yamon to viruz, or swift to tyrus, or ash to shotgun, or ganz to spb. HUGE, yet subtle levels of skill difference.
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These are wrong. Totally wrong there are more than just me who use my tier system. You can make up anything you want doesn't make it true. Thought there are quite a few things accurate about this, good try though.
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You can p robably compare Ash to Shotgun. Shotgun has been better than Ash for about 10 years probably but at his peak yeah Ash was better
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You can p robably compare Ash to Shotgun. Shotgun has been better than Ash for about 10 years probably but at his peak yeah Ash was better
Yeah I'm talking peaks, not current level. Anyways, sh, Louis needs a scolding and you're not helping. He's actually proving that custom players require less skill and have lower peaks than any given pud player. Let him ramble I suppose. He's convinced me that you and others are right blid. And that's not good. Poor lobbying skills Louis.
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Whatever I'm proving those are the top top player, there are more but those are tourny winners and what now. Stop getting butthurt you started shit with me for no reason. I'm not sure why you continue to post long rants at me 100 unresponded messages whatever. I'll support the new server because TK wants good for this game and you too. Don't need your shit though so whatever. Mine are accurate, yours are alright but calm it.
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Whatever I'm proving those are the top top player, there are more but those are tourny winners and what now. Stop getting butthurt you started shit with me for no reason. I'm not sure why you continue to post long rants at me 100 unresponded messages whatever. I'll support the new server because TK wants good for this game and you too. Don't need your shit though so whatever. Mine are accurate, yours are alright but calm it.
Just no. Being near the best at ONE-TWO maps is not indicative of all-around skill. If I 10 mapped most of your tier 1 list I'd 8-2 or better them. The two I would lose are their maps that they have thousands of games logged into. Just... no.
Anyways, Louis unadded me from friends list. At least I don't have to hear emo lyrics anymore. (He types out poems he writes in his off time).
Maybe he might get mad and ban me from tournaments too.
#MANOWAR'S LIFE MATTERS
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Whatever I'm proving those are the top top player, there are more but those are tourny winners and what now. Stop getting butthurt you started shit with me for no reason. I'm not sure why you continue to post long rants at me 100 unresponded messages whatever. I'll support the new server because TK wants good for this game and you too. Don't need your shit though so whatever. Mine are accurate, yours are alright but calm it.
Just no. Being near the best at ONE-TWO maps is not indicative of all-around skill. If I 10 mapped most of your tier 1 list I'd 8-2 or better them. The two I would lose are their maps that they have thousands of games logged into. Just... no.
Anyways, Louis unadded me from friends list. At least I don't have to hear emo lyrics anymore. (He types out poems he writes in his off time).
Maybe he might get mad and ban me from tournaments too.
#MANOWAR'S LIFE MATTERS
Haha..
Ya Mano mentioned he was black listed from his tournaments [emoji23]
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how come ryu isn't listed?
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how come ryu isn't listed?
Because he would rather bot than game. I have zero idea where he would fall on the chart, but it would probably be in the low tier 2 range.
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how come ryu isn't listed?
Because he would rather bot than game. I have zero idea where he would fall on the chart, but it would probably be in the low tier 2 range.
Whoa OK, I won't idle anymore relax lol, there offline. [emoji58]
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Bro <3 Get on and game.
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Bro <3 Get on and game.
Tonight I will like usual [emoji14]
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Anyway like I said mine is the most accurate. I don't really care what Masta's is when he just came back and all lol. Masta sent me like 50 fb messages before and after my post yesterday and started shit so I unfriended him. As I've already told people I don't need the drama. What about my tiers "insulted" ? Who knows. I got thug love for my PBall posse :) .
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... As I've already told people I don't need the drama...
Right....your always the victim and others always start the drama.
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... As I've already told people I don't need the drama...
Right....your always the victim and others always start the drama.
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Oh back to your reading comprehension issues huh Ryu? Never in this thread did I say I am always the victim. I am here because I received barrages of messages and insults. As far as Mano if he's so stupid to say something that personally insulting to someone about something he knows nothing about, YES he is blackballed until he reconciles the problem.
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Oh back to your reading comprehension issues huh Ryu? Never in this thread did I say I am always the victim. I am here because I received barrages of messages and insults. As far as Mano if he's so stupid to say something that personally insulting to someone about something he knows nothing about, YES he is blackballed until he reconciles the problem.
Typically it's a democratic process to blackball someone (I was in Phi Delta Theta for 4 years and VP of my Chapter for 2), so it's technically a tyrannical ban NOT a blackball.
Louis, I think you are taking your conversation with MANO way too hard. Satirical parleys and smalls jabs are the lodestones of Smeagol's drama. You blow nearly everything out of proportion. I suppose your facebook picture and profile paints an even prettier picture of your natural reaction to society's perversions.
I wouldn't mind taking credit for the thumbs up thumbs down for you. But...
1. I didn't know that was related to karma. I'm new to the forums.
2. I didn't even know there was a thumbs up/thumbs down option until you just pointed it out in an above post.
3. Getting thumbs down isn't so bad, you already did it twice to me I see.
So if you see two double thumbs down THEN you'll know it's me, otherwise we just have a case of a Smeagol Hater or a MaStA supporter in our midst. I wonder which is more likely?
To answer your serious concern about me spamming your facebook. I agree that that my 17 to your 11 facebook messages is a bit much... and if we get into you complaining about snow or your emo lyrics, then it actually begins to reverse. Don't hyperexaggerate by saying "50" because you make yourself look ignorant. Isn't it funny how nearly everyone on the forums disagrees with you Smeagol?
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... As I've already told people I don't need the drama...
Right....your always the victim and others always start the drama.
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Oh back to your reading comprehension issues huh Ryu? Never in this thread did I say I am always the victim. I am here because I received barrages of messages and insults. As far as Mano if he's so stupid to say something that personally insulting to someone about something he knows nothing about, YES he is blackballed until he reconciles the problem.
Isn't black balling someone from an tournament that awards an icon against the rules?
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http://forum.war2.ru/index.php/topic,1006.0.html
Mouse says it right here, everyone should be allowed to participate...
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[url]http://forum.war2.ru/index.php/topic,1006.0.html[/url] ([url]http://forum.war2.ru/index.php/topic,1006.0.html[/url])
Mouse says it right here, everyone should be allowed to participate...
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Not even that everyone SHOULD be able to play, but everyone IS ALLOWED to play. You are not allowed to bar anyone even if you don't like them. Smeagol, if you get emotional, and you have some people that you are comparing epenises to and lost, then you should not host tourneys and let someone a little more stable and less spikey host them (like our beloved Tora <3).
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Wrong I am able to do whatever I want. The donators have the say in what happens in the tournaments and trust me myself and all of them are on my side. Mano can smurf and hide like the cyber criminal Archer. Everyone wanted him banned and I complied, Mano is banned too bad deal with it. The money and time put into these tournaments goes to me and the donators. What peons like Masta and Ryu have to say about this mean nothing to me. Mano can be a man and know he's wrong if he wants back in.
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Wrong I am able to do whatever I want. The donators have the say in what happens in the tournaments and trust me myself and all of them are on my side. Mano can smurf and hide like the cyber criminal Archer. Everyone wanted him banned and I complied, Mano is banned too bad deal with it. The money and time put into these tournaments goes to me and the donators. What peons like Masta and Ryu have to say about this mean nothing to me. Mano can be a man and know he's wrong if he wants back in.
I have yet to see anyone agree with you... And WRONG, it is illegal according to Server Admin to bar anyone who has not made technical mistakes (like hack) from tournaments. If they are banned from the server they cannot play, but anyone that can log into the server has a right to any tournament being placed. If you want to make a private tournament, which essentially that is what you are doing by selectively choosing who can participate, then you are no longer allowed to promote it in the way you do and have an icon as one of the prizes.
Please read the rules before you emotional ban someone. I read the conversation between you and MANO and I can't believe you are mad. LOLOL. It was like kindergarten "Your favorite color is purple" type jabs and you got so offended. In fact, it would be more productive to shut your next tournament down until you open it back up to MANO and whoever else you got mad at because you forgot to buy a pack of cigarettes.
You say "everyone" wanted him banned. There are like 20 active pballers, 3 of them being Ryu, me and MANO. I spoke with about half a dozen and they are all scratching their heads about your ban. I hardly doubt you spoke specifically with the rest of them and that they all agreed with you. Stop making carte blanche statements because it makes you sound like a hillbilly.
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I know for a fact Quick{hr} did not want Mano banned also.
Idc what you do Smeagol, just try to treat everyone equally, I know you have a hard time with people who don't embrace your self proclaimed "God" status.
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Wrong I am able to do whatever I want. The donators have the say in what happens in the tournaments and trust me myself and all of them are on my side. Mano can smurf and hide like the cyber criminal Archer...
Doesn't Archer donate to your tournaments? So, your telling me that you take advice from cyber criminals on how to run your tournament? Are you really that stupid?
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Normally I stay out of this stuff but the lies you have been saying about me on here has forced me to register and reply back. I did nothing to you Louis, your a fucking low life Trash, You treat Women like Property and not like a Human being.. Go see your kid and take care of him instead of seeing him 4 times a year... I'm not the one hiding your the one banning me from a pball Facebook page & shit.. Your the one killing Warcraft2... You need help Louis.. You always jump to conclusions & you take everything out of Context.. You Snap for no reason your a Ticking time Bomb waiting to go off.. I see why you been in trouble with the law your attitude say it all..
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Normally I stay out of this stuff but the lies you have been saying about me on here has forced me to register and reply back. I did nothing to you Louis, your a fucking low life Trash, You treat Women like Property and not like a Human being.. Go see your kid and take care of him instead of seeing him 4 times a year... I'm not the one hiding your the one banning me from a pball Facebook page & shit.. Your the one killing Warcraft2... You need help Louis.. You always jump to conclusions & you take everything out of Context.. You Snap for no reason your a Ticking time Bomb waiting to go off.. I see why you been in trouble with the law your attitude say it all..
Mano you are near retarded levels of intelligence so I will let this ride. I am not going to argue with you on a Warcraft 2 forum. Take your garbage to flame wars you garbage retard fat fucking idiot. You are scum and you are banned from my tournaments, get used to it. Go fuck Ryu like usual, I know you guys are gay and as always I won't judge the same way as your wife. Fuck off. I see my kid plenty you've had a kid a few months and neglect it constantly idiot. Fuck off.
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Why you dragging me into this...I didn't say anything. Stop saying lies about him, not cool thought.
So you ban anyone you don't like from server pball tournaments? Pfft, talk about fair tournaments lol. Why is he even allowed to host a tournament that awards an icon...he is clearly breaking the rules. I feel if this was a GoW tournament situation, this would have already been addressed and dealt with.
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Louis aka XXXsmeagolXXX
I would say the retarded intelligent is the one with a criminal record.. That's u buddy... I would prefer not to play with someone who Hacks Now anyways.. Now that's come out you do Hack this brings u to an all time low... Your not only a low life but a low life that has to Hack to Win.. That shows u have no talent... You dont see your kid only 4 times a yr give it up no hiding around that... I live with my kid... Be Man own up to your responsibility... Don't Be dead beat Dad like you are.. Your kid didnt ask come into this world.. Rap that shit up so don't happen again.. I hardly Play when i do babys sleep 17 hours a day but you wouldn't know that since your never around Your kid.. 5 or 6 yrs gone Now.. Can't get that time back my friend.. Be there for him before its to late... Make up for lost time..
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You don't know shit about me kid get the fuck out of here. I have had my son 6 years wow you can add and I have payed over 20,000 dollars. As for criminal you don't know shit about me and I have no felonies on my record. You are some new parent who met my baby Mama a few weeks ago and think you know me. Go fuck yourself. You suck at Warcraft 2 you suck at life. I love my son, you are a fuckin idiot end of story. I will not respond to another drama post by you I don't need your bs. You are banned until you can get your shit together and get a grip.
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This took a pretty embarrassing turn... Come on people. Before you post things, you should ask yourselves, why am I so mad at this person? Is this something I should be posting on a public message board? It is absolutely absurd that an argument over paintball has gone this far. We don't ban people often but if this sort of thing keeps happening I will definitely start banning you all.
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You don't know shit about me kid get the fuck out of here. I have had my son 6 years wow you can add and I have payed over 20,000 dollars. As for criminal you don't know shit about me and I have no felonies on my record. You are some new parent who met my baby Mama a few weeks ago and think you know me. Go fuck yourself. You suck at Warcraft 2 you suck at life. I love my son, you are a fuckin idiot end of story. I will not respond to another drama post by you I don't need your bs. You are banned until you can get your shit together and get a grip.
I know enough about you... Adding had nothing to do with it u moron... I may not Be best Warcraft but don't have Hack like u to Win. That shows u suck... You were Banning me for no reason to begin with.. I'm ban til i get grip ur funny.
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Chairman Blid
All good Chairman Blid bc end of the year I'm leaving Warcraft was good 11 yrs while it lasted.. Louis is Not Worth my time, along with the Drama he gives I'll give it back to him... He's Trash...
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in.
Wrong I am able to do whatever I want. The donators have the say in what happens in the tournaments and trust me myself and all of them are on my side. Mano can smurf and hide like the cyber criminal Archer. Everyone wanted him banned and I complied, Mano is banned too bad deal with it. The money and time put into these tournaments goes to me and the donators. What peons like Masta and Ryu have to say about this mean nothing to me. Mano can be a man and know he's wrong if he wants back in.
You should not ban anyone who has not been caught of hacking on reasons of personal dislike...