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Messages - BabyShark

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Helps if I remember to actually enact, rather than just announce, the ban lol.

easycompany banned from Moderated Section of W2 forum for obscene language

i dont give a **** about you jesu im in it for myself

As this is his second ban, it is one month, from Dec. 11, 2017 10:37 pm to Jan. 11, 2018 10:37 pm.

3) Moderated Section of War2 Forum / Re: MOST BEAUTIFUL SONG IN THE WORLD CONTEST
« on: December 11, 2017, 09:51:23 PM »

Sound Of Silence (cover); Sina feat. Jadyn Rylee - YouTube

This 11-year-old girl Jadyn Rylee is one of the most amazing and moving singers I've ever seen in my life!

4) Moderated Section of War2 Forum / Re: WOMEN'S RIGHTS and FEMINISM
« on: December 11, 2017, 04:50:17 PM »
First of all, this is not a game. These topics have to do with real life.

There are real life girls and women being abused, tortured, mutilated, stoned, beaten, raped, and killed every day in Islamic countries. This is reality.

This is not a game.

I am not here to "win" a "game". I like games and I like to play, but this discussion on truth, reality, beliefs, and practices isn't one of them.

I am here to speak for the victims of abuse and oppression, because I care about them. And I'm here to share the truth of the love of Jesus with you and all people because I care about you. I'm not here to hurt you.

I understand that it feels like reporting facts and sharing interviews of real people who were once Muslims and lived in Islamic countries where brutal abuse of women and girls is the norm and quoting Islamic texts is an attack on you. But my ultimate purpose is to help you realize that Muhammad was not a good guy and that his teachings are not good teachings. He lived a very violent life and killed a lot of people in his life. He was not faithful in marriage, having sex with numerous girls and women, supposedly with the endorsement of "Allah". He married and raped a child. I haven't researched his other wives and sex partners yet, but Aisha was 6 when he "married" her and 9 when he consummated the marriage. He promoted the cutting off of female genitals, which is still cruelly practiced to this very day. He promoted beating women. These are documented in Islamic writings as I have shown in previous posts. But my purpose is to open your eyes to the truth, so you may reject this evil man's false teachings as the work of the devil that they are, and realize your need for a Savior from sin that WE ALL NEED.

Jesus has loved you and me so much He gave His holy life to save us. This is the truth. This truth will set you free from bondage to sin and evil.

You can feel it inside of you, that cutting off little girls' genitals as they struggle and scream while being held down by many forceful hands is wrong. Yet Muhammad endorsed it.

You can feel inside of you, that a man beating a woman is abuse. He is meant to love and protect her. You know it's wrong. Yet Muhammad endorsed it.

You know that murdering people is wrong (even if they are Jews, Christians, atheists, or other non-Muslims), yet Muhammad endorsed Jihad against infidels until all are subjugated and no one worships any god but Allah, who is a false god.

Your conscience tells you these things are wrong. Even the people practicing these things know they are wrong. All the testimonies in the videos indicate that female genital mutilation is something they do not discuss openly. Little girls were threatened with death if they told anyone what happened. They are HIDING it, because they KNOW it's wrong. All of us have a God-given conscience that tells us right from wrong.

Muhammad was wrong. Muhammad's work is from Satan, not God. Satan often tries to copy and pervert and twist what God's created and what God's said and turn a beautiful thing into an ugly thing.

I understand that you're frustrated. I do. I feel for you. If you feel the need to throw insults my way, I understand. I know that according to Islam, saying the ugly truth about Muhammad or criticizing the teachings of Islam is punishable by death. I understand if you want me dead. I know where I'm going when I die. I know Jesus and heaven are waiting for me on the other side.

I want you to have that same comfort, that same knowledge, that your sins have been paid for, that you are loved, you are forgiven, you are precious and valuable, as is each human being to God. God made each of us, boys and girls, men and women, and each one of us is loved.

The true and living God wants people to live in harmony, love, and peace.

1 Corinthians 13:4-8a

4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

8 Love never fails.

God's love put us first. He sacrificed Himself to act in our best interest, so we could be saved from the penalty of our sins.

That's how God wants us to love each other as humans on earth.

Matthew 22

37 Jesus said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”

Romans 5:8

6 For when we were still without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. 7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die; yet perhaps for a good man someone would even dare to die. 8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him. 10 For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. 11 And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation.

I am praying for you and Tora and Lightbringer, and others. I'm not your enemy. I am actually pretty confident that in time, within 5 years, you will become a Christian. Your heart is searching for the truth. I pray that you will find it.

But I understand if you see me the way you were raised to see me, as an enemy to be killed because I will not worship Allah nor will I tolerate the teachings that encourage abuse of women and girls and promote killing people. And if death comes to me one day for speaking the truth to help people, then I can only hope and pray that I can be brave in the face of the pain that will come before it.

I will also comment on a number of things that you've brought up, in the near future, but the reason I'm holding back from doing so at this time is because the most important thing for you to see and know is that you are loved. I want you to have some time to focus on how much you are loved by the living God.

So when I fight for the truth, when you see me in "combat" mode, asserting the truths of God's Word, recognize that I'm doing it because I care about you. And I care about truth.

I want you to know love, real love, the love of God that never dies, that has turned me and you from sinful wretch to beloved treasure.

You are a treasure to the living God.

We have all sinned and earned hell.

This is what He stepped out of heaven's glory to do to save mankind from its own sinfulness. This was His plan to save us, because the wages of sin is death and hell, and we had earned it, but God poured His wrath on a perfect, holy, innocent substitute, Jesus Christ, who literally loved us to death.

So He could have us with Him in heaven!

5) General Discussion / Re: Female Genital Mutilation *Graphic video*
« on: December 10, 2017, 09:49:31 AM »
Before your next enraged outburst of hate, I encourage you to do something that will be very difficult for you and use your intellect.

Are you angry because girls and women are being abused? Are you angry at the injustice and suffering they experience?

Or are you angry because I'm telling people after learning about it?

I had no idea female genital mutilation was a part of Islam prescribed by Muhammad at the time when you first brought up Islam. I have learned so much about Islam so I thank you for prodding me to learn more about it so I can become a voice for the abused women.

Think hard about why you are angry.

Is your anger just? Or is your anger because of pride in your Islamic identity and you don't like the truths that are coming to light?

Truth is truth, whether we like it or not.

You have a choice about what you're going to support and protect.

You can convert away from the ideology of Islam. You now recognize serious problems with the teachings, including the promotion of violent, cruel, barbaric abuse against women and girls.

You don't have to stand by it. It's a choice.

6) Moderated Section of War2 Forum / Re: WOMEN'S RIGHTS and FEMINISM
« on: December 10, 2017, 09:40:17 AM »

I'm relieved to see we are finally both on the same page in caring about human rights and stopping abuse!

Let's join together to protest the abuse happening within our religions.

I will stand in front of a local church holding a sign reading "Stop Hand Amputation" and you will stand in front of a local mosque holding a sign reading "Stop Female Genital Mutilation, Wife-Beating, Child Marriage, and Stoning Women".

We will each take a picture of ourselves with our signs in front of the buildings and post them in this forum.


7) General Discussion / Re: Female Genital Mutilation *Graphic video*
« on: December 10, 2017, 07:58:16 AM »
You have something against anyone that tells the truth.

You need to seriously consider your version of reality.

These are factual things that are happening.

You want to protect and hide the truth so the abuse can continue.

Don't pretend to be a "peaceful" or "moderate" Muslim if you want to protect people who force children into "marriage" and cut off girl's genitals forcibly while the child is screaming and threaten to kill her if she tells anyone.

If you want to protect people who beat girls and women and stone them to death for alleged inappropriate conduct, you are part of the problem.

Abuse can't go on if people expose and resist it.

Abuse needs to be stopped.

You attacking me for exposing the truth shows more about you than it does about me. So I welcome it. Spew all the hate you can, so everyone can see who the real "hater" is. Maybe we should call you a racist sexist Christophobe?


Women are not property. They are human beings and deserve human rights.

8) General Discussion / Female Genital Mutilation *Graphic video*
« on: December 10, 2017, 07:38:14 AM »

Little girl being circumcised. Female Genital Mutilation. - YouTube

This cruel and barbaric violation of human rights needs to be stopped. What I want to know is WHERE ARE ALL THE FEMINISTS TO PROTEST the outrageous damage and harm being caused to these little girls against their will?? The very vocal and demonstrative "MY BODY MY CHOICE" activists who claim to champion women's rights are SILENT when it comes to abuse of girls and women in Islam.

This practice is coming into civilized Western countries when its proponents come to these countries. It's ILLEGAL, but it's HAPPENING.


Female Genital Mutilation Rises In UK | FGM "Parties" | No Prosecutions - YouTube


Underground in America: Female Genital Mutilation | ABC News - YouTube


Women speak out on female genital mutilation in Australia - YouTube

Personal stories from women who were mutilated


Aisha, 33

What I vividly remember is my sister and I were playing, and a woman came and took us. This was in The Gambia, and I was 6 and my sister was 3 at the time. This woman was known in the village, and she told us she was taking us somewhere to see something. Like little kids do, we tagged along. We went into a home, and immediately women grabbed and blindfolded us and tied us to some thick bushes.

I could smell the leaves, the dirt, everything around us. I knew we were no longer in a home setting, but outside somewhere. There was loud drumming and older women were singing songs, which I was too young to understand. I could hear other kids crying out in pain, but I didn't know why.

I was dragged to a fence covered in leaves, and they took the blindfold off. I could see the other girls bleeding and sobbing in pain. I saw an old woman holding a knife so sharp I could see the drops of blood sliding down the edge. It was the blood of the other girls.

Three other women were holding down my arms and legs, and another was sitting right on my chest, covering my mouth. They try to put pressure on you, so you don't cry for the next girl to hear. I can still feel the weight of her today. I can still visualize all their faces as I talk about this. I can see what each one of them looks like and the emotions that they had — so empty, like they didn't see me as a human being.

The cutting happens very fast. What the cutter does is hold on to your clitoris to make sure she gets that and scrapes everything else that comes along with it — all of the labia, if they can. I fought the whole time, and as a result, only my clitoris and part of my left labia are cut. The other side is still intact. My mother told me recently that when this happens they will often wait until the girl has a child. Then they will finish the job, cutting everything off they didn't get the first time.

After all the girls in my group were cut, we were left to bleed into little dirt holes for hours. Finally, when it became dark, we were taken to the home of the woman who did the cutting and crowded into one room to heal. We were there three months. We ate out of one shared bowl.

In the morning, we would wake up, line up, and receive our "treatment." They took dried leaves and placed them on the wound and that would stay on for two to three days. Then they would rip it off and put another one on until the tissue began to scar. Every morning a woman came in to teach us songs, and if we didn't memorize the words, she would beat us. We were also taught, every day, that if we ever talked about this, if we even mentioned it, they would kill us.

I became friends with these girls. We bonded and ended up going to school together. I learned two of them later died in childbirth, which was too difficult for them because of FGM. They bled to death.

At the end of the three months, there was a ceremony to celebrate that we had gone through the rite of passage. My mother came to pick us up, and I kept asking, "Why did they do this to me? Where were you?"

She just responded, "They told you not to say anything, right? Then don't talk about it." I never got an explanation until years later. I work in health care now, and I have so many questions about my health that has to do with something so significant regarding my genitalia. So I pressed my mother again. She finally said she did it to protect me. She said, "If I were to take you out of that equation, you would be regarded as an outcast, an unclean person. You would not be a part of us. And I don't want anyone to be an outcast of our society. This is who we are."

She also admitted that she couldn't be there when they took us — even though she arranged for it — because it was too painful for her.

I know 100 women who I am related to, all of them will be cut. My uncle's wife now took over in our village, and she's the one who has the knife. All my nieces and any girl born in my family will be cut.

My sister came to the U.S. for her education, and she was the one who helped me come here as well. She cannot have kids as a result of her FGM. I have two daughters now and had to be cut open again to have each one. But I had them here, with a doctor. Back in Gambia, I could have died. My girls will be the only ones in my family who will not have to go through FGM. I know if I ever have my daughters in Gambia, they will do to them what they did to me. My mother assured me of this. I will never take them back. My family will never see them.

This is criminal. This is barbaric. This is against human rights. This is evil.

9) Moderated Section of War2 Forum / Re: WOMEN'S RIGHTS and FEMINISM
« on: December 10, 2017, 07:16:56 AM »
I agree. The Muslim men who are adulterers should not be throwing stones at women they accuse of adultery (who are often actually innocent).

Woman Stoned for Alleged Adultery (GRAPHIC) - YouTube

I also say the Muslim men who want sexual pleasure themselves should not deprive women of sexual pleasure by ensuring all Muslim females have their clitoris and/or labia cut off forcibly and against their will because Muhammad thought it was a good idea.

Female Genital Mutilation - FGM English - YouTube

Female Genital Mutilation And Islam- THE FACTS - YouTube

Halal Certification link to FGM Female Genital Mutilation & Islam - YouTube

How I Survived Female Genital Mutilation - YouTube

This mutilation and amputation of women's healthy sex organs provides NO health benefits, but rather many complications including death, extreme pain with childbirth, hemorrhage, HIV, trauma, urinary problems, severe pain, infection, wound healing problems, shock, plus psychological effects, depression, anxiety, post traumatic stress disorder, and of course the obvious, NEVER BEING ABLE TO FEEL SEXUAL PLEASURE IN THEIR ENTIRE LIVES.

I also say Muslim men who don't want their bodies and minds destroyed, damaged, and traumatized should not destroy, damage, and traumatize little girls by "marrying" and raping them, sometimes killing them by forcibly penetrating a girl's body that is nowhere close to being ready for adult relations. Oh by the way, her genitals have already been cut out and sewn up, often leaving just a tiny hole where pee (and blood when she grows up) can come out. The man is supposed to force himself into a child's body through the stitched up, already traumatized tissue. Torture for her, obviously. It's sick. Pedophilia is part of Islam, and Muhammad himself married and raped a little girl.

8-year-old Yemeni Child Bride Dies on Wedding Night! - YouTube

11 Year Old Child Bride Speaks About Evil Islam, Murdered After - YouTube

Muslim men don't want to be beaten with weapons by people stronger than them. Yet they do this to girls and women. Here a man beats a girl who ran away from an abusive forced marriage.

How To Beat Your Child Bride _ savage tradition - YouTube

I agree with you.

I think people should treat people the way they want to be treated. That's what the Bible teaches.

Luke 6:31

Do to others as you would have them do to you.

10) Moderated Section of War2 Forum / Re: WOMEN'S RIGHTS and FEMINISM
« on: December 07, 2017, 03:20:36 PM »
One of my takeaways from these discussions so far is that we North American women are actually quite spoiled and whine about relatively petty things.

I now just want to worship the ground my husband walks on and go enjoy the body parts that I still actually have that haven't been cut out with him.

I suspect I may be rather *busy* for a little while.

11) Moderated Section of War2 Forum / Re: WOMEN'S RIGHTS and FEMINISM
« on: December 07, 2017, 07:45:09 AM »
I want you to recognize, @Ze_sAiNt, that my purpose is not to "make people look bad", but to help people. I actually have developed a lot more compassion for Muslim people by learning more about the religion and culture. I care about the people, including you.

I readily admit that my hope is that people who are persuaded by the teachings of Muhammad will recognize that there are problems in his teachings and life, including that he married and had sex with a child. Children should not be having sex and young girls' bodies can be seriously traumatized and damaged by forcible penetration by an adult. I would like truth and goodness to be prioritized over believing everything this man wrote or making his not very admirable life to be the "perfect example". I know that when you have been taught the same thing from childhood, it's really hard to think everything you learned is wrong. But it is my belief that it is a religion that is not based on truth and the values and teachings promoted are not good. I think children deserve to be loved and protected. I think women deserve to be loved and protected. I think boys and men deserve to be loved and protected.

I would like to see men and women to genuinely love and care for and value each other. I would like to see children loved. Even if you and I don't see things the same way, I want you to know I'm praying for you, as well as for Tora and Lightbringer, that you would come to know the love of Jesus personally. So many Muslims have been saved and come to know truth and love and freedom from an oppressive system of rules and laws that does not guarantee salvation for anyone, especially not for Muslim women, with whom Islam's hellfires are crowded.

I would ultimately like all men to come to a knowledge of the truth of Jesus Christ, and His love and forgiveness for all people. Jesus loves Muslims and His blood won forgiveness for every single one of them too, not only for me. We all have done wrong against God's holy laws.



Muhammad's sex life according to Islamic writings:


I already admitted that I knew quite little about Islam outside of the public perception and just minimal surface stuff that I'd learned up til that point in my life, when Tora brought it up on these forums. His bringing it up led me to go more and more into it.

There really are horrific abuses going on within Islam, and I think the abuses go further than what the Quran specifies (ie. disfiguring faces with acid and cutting off noses are more advanced than beating with a scourge) and there are horrific abuses going on outside of Islam. Certainly abuse is not limited to Islam. But when women are religiously and culturally categorized as less than men and as men's property, it paves the way for mistreatment of all kinds. Who is going to stand up for another man's property if he chooses to damage it? And yes, as the Bible is an accurate historical book, we see oppression of women in history in other cultures and peoples besides Islam as well.

I say it should be stopped wherever it's found by whomever it's done.

If I'm taking the verses of the Quran out of context, then so are the majority of Muslims who do act on them and act in violence against non-Muslims and women.

From my reading of it, it reads as though violence is to be used until there is no worship of anyone besides Allah and no resistance to subjugation. It is certainly forced on everyone. Even the Muslim men in the video say the same.

Even though Muslim men are committing abuses against Muslim women, I do also see Muslim men as victims of an oppressive religion and oppressive system.

I think men naturally want to be loved.

I do not think a woman is capable of loving a man who beats her and treats her terribly, like a thing, and I think he does these things because that's what he is raised to believe is appropriate behavior and pleasing to Allah.

I even wonder how Muslim men are able to enjoy sex with a woman or girl who is unable to feel pleasure because she has had her clitoris cut out. I don't know what joy or pleasure there is in having sex with someone who is forced to have sex with you whether she likes it or not and can't enjoy it anyways. I know that for most North .American men, the woman's desire and pleasure is enormously important and a source of his own pleasure.

I feel compassion for Muslim men who are deprived of love and who have to live with their own violent acts against the women they are designed to love and protect. It must be a horrible feeling deep inside.

It's a bad system. Cutting off a woman's genitals is completely barbaric and disgusting. I feel so much compassion for the girls and women who have this done to them, and have to live the rest of their life amputated from a big and pretty important part of being a human, their sexuality and experiencing sexual pleasure, all because men want to make sure they don't run off with some guy or have sex with anyone they shouldn't, but most of all because Allah (ie. Muhammad) prescribes it.

Female genital mutilation is a prescribed practice in Islam, and these traditions and practices follow Muslims wherever they go. So FGM, even though illegal in "Western" countries like USA and UK, is practiced there in Muslim communities. Many girls were flown out to have their genitals cut off, and then flown back in, but when authorities started clamping down on the borders and having girls removed from the UK, Musims started flying practitioners in to do multiple girls at once, in secret.

Circumcision is not an inherited custom as some people claim, rather it is prescribed in Islam and the scholars are unanimously agreed that it is prescribed. Not a single Muslim scholar – as far as we know – has said that circumcision is not prescribed.

Their evidence is to be found in the saheeh ahaadeeth of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), which prove that it is prescribed, for example:


    The hadeeth narrated by al-Bukhaari (5889) and Muslim (257) from Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him), that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: "The fitrah is five things – or five things are part of the fitrah – circumcision, shaving the pubes, cutting the nails, plucking the armpit hairs, and trimming the moustache."

    This hadeeth includes circumcision of both males and females.


    Muslim (349) narrated that ‘Aa’ishah (may Allaah be pleased with her) said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “When a man sits between the four parts (arms and legs of his wife) and the two circumcised parts meet, then ghusl is obligatory.”

    The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) mentioned the two circumcised parts, i.e., the circumcised part of the husband and the circumcised part of the wife, which indicates that a woman may be circumcised just like a man.


    Abu Dawood (5271) narrated from Umm ‘Atiyyah al-Ansaariyyah that a woman used to do circumcisions in Madeenah and the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said to her: “Do not go to the extreme in cutting; that is better for the woman and more liked by the husband.” But the scholars differed concerning this hadeeth. Some of them classed it as da’eef (weak) and others classed it as saheeh. It was classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood. The fact that circumcision for women is prescribed in Islam is confirmed by the ahaadeeth quoted above, not by this disputed hadeeth. But the scholars differed concerning the ruling, and there are three opinions:

1 –

    That it is obligatory for both males and females. This is the view of the Shaafa’is and Hanbalis, and is the view favoured by al-Qaadi Abu Bakr ibn al-‘Arabi among the Maalikis (may Allaah have mercy on them all).

    Al-Nawawi (may Allaah have mercy on him) said in al-Majmoo’ (1/367): "Circumcision is obligatory for both men and women in our view. This is the view of many of the salaf, as was narrated by al-Khattaabi. Among those who regarded it as obligatory is Ahmad… it is the correct view that is well known and was stated by al-Shaafa’i (may Allaah have mercy on him), and the majority stated definitively that it is obligatory for both men and women."

    See Fath al-Baari, 10/340; Kishshaaf al-Qinaa’, 1/80

2 –

    That circumcision is Sunnah for both males and females. This is the view of the Hanafis and Maalikis, and was narrated in one report from Ahmad. Ibn ‘Aabideen al-Hanafi (may Allaah have mercy on him) said in his Haashiyah (6/751): "In Kitaab al-Tahaarah of al-Siraaj al-Wahhaaj it says: Know that circumcision is Sunnah in our view – i.e., according to the Hanafis – for men and for women."

    See: Mawaahib al-Jaleel, 3/259

3 –

    That circumcision is obligatory for men and is good and mustahabb for women. This is the third view of Imam Ahmad, and it is the view of some Maalikis such as Sahnoon. This view was also favoured by al-Muwaffaq ibn Qudaamah in al-Mughni.

    See: al-Tamheed, 21/60; al-Mughni, 1/63

It says in Fataawa al-Lajnah al-Daa’imah (5/223):

    "Circumcision is one of the Sunnahs of the fitrah, and it is for both males and females, except that is it obligatory for males and Sunnah and good in the case of women."

Thus it is clear that the fuqaha’ of Islam are agreed that circumcision is prescribed for both males and females, and in fact the majority of them are of the view that it is obligatory for both. No one said that it is not prescribed or that it is makrooh or haraam.

(Taken from https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Female_Genital_Mutilation)

12) Moderated Section of War2 Forum / Re: WOMEN'S RIGHTS and FEMINISM
« on: December 07, 2017, 01:49:51 AM »
There are very different scenarios that can all be categorized as the same thing.

A strange man breaks into a woman's home, attacks her and rapes her.

A young man and woman get tipsy, start making out, end up going all the way, the woman later claims she was under the influence and couldn't properly consent and therefore she was raped.

A woman changes her mind during or after sex that she agreed to and can claim she was raped.

The experience doesn't live up to her expectations and is perhaps uncomfortable, even painful.

Every fake or false or frivolous rape allegation is actually helping real rape charges not be taken as seriously. Of course, men can avoid most of the frivolous and ludicrous fake charges by not having sex with strangers who may expect a relationship and become bitter and angry when the man is not interested and want revenge. Then his DNA won't be found inside her body as evidence.

If the physical evidence is there, it is extremely difficult to prove, in the absence of video or voice recording, what was or was not said prior to any given encounter.

Here is an "I was raped and no one cares" claim where a girl didn't have the most blissful experience in the sack, and therefore decided she was raped since she "kind of" didn't want him to finish up when he was very close to orgasm:


This is a reason among the many already listed as reasons not to have casual sex.

You need to be able to trust that the person is not going to try to send you to prison if they either don't like the experience or want more of a relationship than you do.

Here is a story about 17 year Jay Cheshire from UK who was falsely accused and was so distraught that he killed himself, and then his mother was so distraught that she killed herself:



The girl who made the false accusation caused the deaths of two innocent people and walked away scot-free and anonymous to media.

False rape accusations are as bad as the crime of rape itself. It ruins lives, both of the falsely accused, and of honest women who are raped and want to press charges. It makes real victims of the vile crime of rape be eyed with suspicion.

If a female makes an accusation, often a man is considered guilty before he is even given a trial or before any evidence has been examined. In America, people are supposedly "innocent until proven guilty", but it doesn't always play out that way. The media trumpet the story and reputations are smeared before a trial has been conducted or before any actual evidence is examined. People should be more careful to look into facts before shouting labels about people.

Both men and women deserve protection from the law, from false accusations and from vile physical crimes, and the penalty for false rape accusations needs to be a lot tougher than it currently is. And those would of course need to go through a proper trial, overturning every shred of evidence like anything else.

Elizabeth Coast lied about being raped and a man was sentenced to prison for 7 years, but after serving 4, she apparently felt guilty and admitted she had lied. She served 2 months in jail.

4 years for the innocent. 2 months for the guilty. NOT QUITE JUSTICE if you ask me.


Linsey Attridge chose strangers from facebook to accuse of rape. She even punched herself to make her story more credible. The randomly chosen strangers were arrested and their lives turned upside down with tests and interrogations. Their reputations were smeared. They were harassed by the community since people become justifiably upset when girls are hurt. When it came out that it was a lie to gain attention and sympathy from her boyfriend, all she got was 200 measly hours of community service.

Her acting was terrific, according to the article:

Throughout this process, Linsey sobbed, shook with fright and even made herself sick to hoodwink the female friend supporting her through her ‘ordeal’.

Her victims' lives were seriously damaged:

"Out in the real world, Philip’s ordeal was much worse: ‘He got harassed in the street; even in the school grounds parents were looking him up and down,’ remembers Kelly. ‘It was just horrible. I’m sure people were looking at me thinking “What is she still doing with him?” ’

The whispering at the gates of their daughter’s school became so unbearable that they withdrew her, moving her to another school where the pupils and parents knew nothing of Philip’s arrest.

‘We could tell what people were thinking by the way they were looking at us,’ says Kelly.

‘That’s why we ended up putting her in another school. That was hard.’"

‘Why would you do something like that? How many lives has she ruined? I wonder if she realises that it was a little girl’s life she ruined, too?’


Cori Lynn Osiecki falsely accused her ex-boyfriend after he broke up with her. She later admitted to lying. I found no record of her receiving any kind of punishment.

I think if the punishment for false charges was more significant than a little community service or a measly 2 months in jail, people might think twice before going out to destroy the lives of innocent people including their target(s) and all the women and girls who are true victims of horrible crimes.

14) Moderated Section of War2 Forum / Re: MOST BEAUTIFUL SONG IN THE WORLD CONTEST
« on: December 06, 2017, 09:23:33 PM »

The video you posted didn't work. Can you edit your post with a video link that does work or just make a new reply with a functioning link so people can give it a listen?

I added it to the poll, though.

Each person is allowed to enter up to 3 songs.

15) Moderated Section of War2 Forum / Re: WOMEN'S RIGHTS and FEMINISM
« on: December 06, 2017, 12:34:59 PM »
I've been asking for proof from the Qur'an that Islam condones the abuse of women but it seems like my requests have been falling on deaf ears.  Point out to any Qur'anic verse that preaches the abuse of women to prove your claim.

Qur'an 4:34 (Pickthall)—Men are in charge of women, because Allah hath made the one of them to excel the other, and because they spend of their property (for the support of women). So good women are the obedient, guarding in secret what Allah hath guarded. As for those from whom ye fear rebellion, admonish them and banish them to beds apart, and scourge them. Then if they obey you, seek not a way against them. Lo! Allah is ever High Exalted, Great.

The woman doesn't even have to do anything to earn the beating. He only has to "fear" rebellion, and he can send her to her own bed and scourge her.

The following quotes are taken from http://survincity.com/2012/12/in-islamic-countries-there-was-a-book-on-how-to/

Thus, the author of the book "Women in Islam" Mohamed Kamal Mustafa believes that a woman is beaten with a switch (not too thick), as the strikes have to bring it in the first place, "not physical, but spiritual suffering." The author recommends that men "to strike the sensitive parts of the body: face, chest, abdomen, head, and so on."

Finally, the author of the book "On the subordination of women in Islam" Hassan Asha articulates the cases in which a man is to dismiss his hands. Such a method of influence on his wife say if she refuses to smarten up before meeting her husband, does not want to satisfy his sexual needs, neglects her religious duties without permission leaves the house.

Above image taken from https://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages/quran/wife-beating.aspx

The above site also includes the quote listed above that allows men to beat/scourge wives from the Quran, plus quotes from other Islamic texts (Hadith and Sira):

Sahih Bukhari (72:715) - A woman came to Muhammad and begged him to stop her husband from beating her. Her skin was bruised so badly that it is described as being "greener" than the green veil she was wearing. Muhammad did not admonish her husband, but instead ordered her to return to him and submit to his sexual desires.

Sahih Bukhari (72:715) - "Aisha said, 'I have not seen any woman suffering as much as the believing women'" Muhammad's own wife complained Muslim women were abused worse than other women.

Sahih Muslim (4:2127) - Muhammad struck his favorite wife, Aisha, in the chest one evening when she left the house without his permission. Aisha narrates, "He struck me on the chest which caused me pain."

Sahih Muslim (9:3506) - Muhammad's fathers-in-law (Abu Bakr and Umar) amused him by slapping his wives (Aisha and Hafsa) for annoying him. According to the Hadith, the prophet of Islam laughed upon hearing this.

Abu Dawud (2141) - "Iyas bin ‘Abd Allah bin Abi Dhubab reported the Apostle of Allah (may peace be upon him) as saying: Do not beat Allah’s handmaidens, but when ‘Umar came to the Apostle of Allah (may peace be upon him) and said: Women have become emboldened towards their husbands, he (the Prophet) gave permission to beat them." (This is graded sahih - authentic) At first, Muhammad forbade men from beating their wives.  As the hadith indicates, he rescinded this once it was reported that women were becoming emboldened toward their husbands. Beatings in a Muslim marriage were deemed necessary at times to keep the woman in her place.

Abu Dawud (2142) - "The Prophet (peace be upon him) said: A man will not be asked as to why he beat his wife."  The authenticity of this chain of narration is characterized as daif (weak), however, a similar verse from Sunan Ibn Majah 3:9:1986 is said to be hasan (sufficient).

Abu Dawud (2126) - "A man from the Ansar called Basrah said: 'I married a virgin woman in her veil. When I entered upon her, I found her pregnant. (I mentioned this to the Prophet).' The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: 'She will get the dower, for you made her vagina lawful for you. The child will be your slave. When she has begotten (a child), flog her'" A Muslim man thinks he is getting a virgin for a wife, then finds out that she is pregnant. Muhammad tells him to treat the woman as a sex slave and then flog her after she delivers the child.  (Despite multiple chains of narration, this hadith is graded as daif).

Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 969 - Requires that a married woman be "put in a separate room and beaten lightly" if she "act in a sexual manner toward others." According to the Hadith, this can be for an offense as petty as merely being alone with a man to whom she is not related.

Kash-shaf (the revealer) of al-Zamkhshari (Vol. 1, p. 525) - [Muhammad said] "Hang up your scourge where your wife can see it"


I'm certainly not suggesting that all Muslims beat their wives or that all Muslims that do beat their wives beat them or mutilate them as severely. But it is fact that it is common practice and it is commonly done and the men do not face punishment for these things, as the women are seen as his property do with with as he wishes.

I do call out people who call themselves Muslims for NOT calling out other Muslims who DO engage in barbaric, violent, cruel practices against women and girls. If you call yourself a Muslim and do NOT believe that women should be treated in these ways, you should be at the forefront of the voices calling for an end to the violence. The reality is that "Muslims" who want to be peaceful and not live in the manners prescribed by Islam are NOT considered true Muslims by devout Muslims, and will be risking their own lives to speak up. There is a lot of fear about being honest and exposing things that are going on where they are in fact happening.

Surely some countries are more "strict" in their practice than others, as are certain individuals within any given community. There are different brands of Islam and I certainly do not believe that everyone who calls or considers themselves Muslim approves of treating women this way. But those that do speak out and question Islam are branded Kafir and in Muslim majority countries are either ostracized or killed. In America, murder is less common and they are often just hated and villified and threatened, since USA still offers protection to its inhabitants and those who commit murders are normally going to be prosecuted.

But these "honor" killings and abuses do happen and there are real problems that need to be addressed and examined and talked about openly between all the people who do care about the way people are treated, whether they identify as Muslim or atheist or Christian or Jew or whatever else, anyone who cares about human rights and the treatment of abused women WHEREVER it happens BY WHOMEVER it is done and want to put a stop to it should be talking to each other and uniting against the violence.

The labels "Islamophobe" and "racist" are applied equally to Muslims and Arabs who question Islamic beliefs and practices. This is clearly, plainly completely an issue of beliefs and practices and nothing at all to do with race.

Female genital mutilation is also common in Islamic countries.


Taken from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_genital_mutilation

Type 1 is "partial or total removal of the clitoris and/or the prepuce". Type Ia (circumcision)[39] involves removal of the clitoral hood only. This is rarely performed alone.[d] The more common procedure is Type Ib (clitoridectomy), the complete or partial removal of the clitoral glans (the visible tip of the clitoris) and clitoral hood.[1][41] The circumciser pulls the clitoral glans with her thumb and index finger and cuts it off.[e]

Type II (excision) is the complete or partial removal of the inner labia, with or without removal of the clitoral glans and outer labia. Type IIa is removal of the inner labia; Type IIb, removal of the clitoral glans and inner labia; and Type IIc, removal of the clitoral glans, inner and outer labia. Excision in French can refer to any form of FGM.[1]
Type III

Type III (infibulation or pharaonic circumcision), the "sewn closed" category, involves the removal of the external genitalia and fusion of the wound. The inner and/or outer labia are cut away, with or without removal of the clitoral glans.[f] Type III is found largely in northeast Africa, particularly Djibouti, Eritrea, Ethiopia, Somalia, and Sudan (although not in South Sudan). According to one 2008 estimate, over eight million women in Africa are living with Type III FGM.[g] According to UNFPA in 2010, 20 percent of women with FGM have been infibulated.[44] In Somalia:

    The child is made to squat on a stool or mat facing the circumciser at a height that offers her a good view of the parts to be handled. ...[A]dult helpers grab and pull apart the legs of the girl. ... If available, this is the stage at which a local anaesthetic would be used.

    The element of speed and surprise is vital and the circumciser immediately grabs the clitoris by pinching it between her nails aiming to amputate it with a slash. The organ is then shown to the senior female relatives of the child who will decide whether the amount that has been removed is satisfactory or whether more is to be cut off.
    External images

        Type III
        IIIb (virgin)
        IIIb (sexually active)

    — RAINBO,[45] Swiss Medical Weekly[6]

    After the clitoris has been satisfactorily amputated ... the circumciser can proceed with the total removal of the labia minora and the paring of the inner walls of the labia majora. Since the entire skin on the inner walls of the labia majora has to be removed all the way down to the perineum, this becomes a messy business. By now, the child is screaming, struggling, and bleeding profusely, which makes it difficult for the circumciser to hold with bare fingers and nails the slippery skin and parts that are to be cut or sutured together. ...
    Having ensured that sufficient tissue has been removed to allow the desired fusion of the skin, the circumciser pulls together the opposite sides of the labia majora, ensuring that the raw edges where the skin has been removed are well approximated. The wound is now ready to be stitched or for thorns to be applied. If a needle and thread are being used, close tight sutures will be placed to ensure that a flap of skin covers the vulva and extends from the mons veneris to the perineum, and which, after the wound heals, will form a bridge of scar tissue that will totally occlude the vaginal introitus.[46]

The amputated parts might be placed in a pouch for the girl to wear.[47] A single hole of 2–3 mm is left for the passage of urine and menstrual fluid.[h] The vulva is closed with surgical thread, or agave or acacia thorns, and might be covered with a poultice of raw egg, herbs and sugar. To help the tissue bond, the girl's legs are tied together, often from hip to ankle; the bindings are usually loosened after a week and removed after two to six weeks.[48][28]:491 If the remaining hole is too large in the view of the girl's family, the procedure is repeated.[49]

The vagina is opened for sexual intercourse, for the first time either by a midwife with a knife or by the woman's husband with his penis.[49] In some areas, including Somaliland, female relatives of the bride and groom might watch the opening of the vagina to check that the girl is a virgin.[50] Psychologist Hanny Lightfoot-Klein interviewed hundreds of women and men in Sudan in the 1980s about sexual intercourse with Type III:

    The penetration of the bride's infibulation takes anywhere from 3 or 4 days to several months. Some men are unable to penetrate their wives at all (in my study over 15%), and the task is often accomplished by a midwife under conditions of great secrecy, since this reflects negatively on the man's potency. Some who are unable to penetrate their wives manage to get them pregnant in spite of the infibulation, and the woman's vaginal passage is then cut open to allow birth to take place. ... Those men who do manage to penetrate their wives do so often, or perhaps always, with the help of the "little knife". This creates a tear which they gradually rip more and more until the opening is sufficient to admit the penis.[51]

The woman is opened further for childbirth (defibulation or deinfibulation), and closed again afterwards (reinfibulation). Reinfibulation can involve cutting the vagina again to restore the pinhole size of the first infibulation. This might be performed before marriage, and after childbirth, divorce and widowhood.[52]
Type IV

Type IV is "[a]ll other harmful procedures to the female genitalia for non-medical purposes", including pricking, piercing, incising, scraping and cauterization.[1] It includes nicking of the clitoris (symbolic circumcision), burning or scarring the genitals, and introducing substances into the vagina to tighten it.[53][54] Labia stretching is also categorized as Type IV.[55] Common in southern and eastern Africa, the practice is supposed to enhance sexual pleasure for the man and add to the sense of a woman as a closed space. From the age of eight, girls are encouraged to stretch their inner labia using sticks and massage. Girls in Uganda are told they may have difficulty giving birth without stretched labia.[j][57]

A definition of FGM from the WHO in 1995 included gishiri cutting and angurya cutting, found in Nigeria and Niger. These were removed from the WHO's 2008 definition because of insufficient information about prevalence and consequences.[58] Angurya cutting is excision of the hymen, usually performed seven days after birth. Gishiri cutting involves cutting the vagina's front or back wall with a blade or penknife, performed in response to infertility, obstructed labour and other conditions. In a study by Nigerian physician Mairo Usman Mandara, over 30 percent of women with gishiri cuts were found to have vesicovaginal fistulae (holes that allow urine to seep into the vagina).[59]
Short-term and late
External image
Keloidal scar tissue
 — RAINBO, 1999[45]:97

FGM harms women's physical and emotional health throughout their lives.[60][61]:49 It has no known health benefits.[8] The short-term and late complications depend on the type of FGM, whether the practitioner has had medical training, and whether they used antibiotics and sterilized or single-use surgical instruments. In the case of Type III, other factors include how small a hole was left for the passage of urine and menstrual blood, whether surgical thread was used instead of agave or acacia thorns, and whether the procedure was performed more than once (for example, to close an opening regarded as too wide or re-open one too small).[6]

Common short-term complications include swelling, excessive bleeding, pain, urine retention, and healing problems/wound infection. A 2015 systematic review of 56 studies that recorded immediate complications suggested that each of these occurred in more than one in ten girls and women undergoing any form of FGM, including symbolic nicking of the clitoris (Type IV), although the risks increased with Type III. The review also suggested that there was under-reporting.[62] Other short-term complications include fatal bleeding, anaemia, urinary infection, septicaemia, tetanus, gangrene, necrotizing fasciitis (flesh-eating disease), and endometritis.[61]:49[63][6] It is not known how many girls and women die as a result of the practice, because complications may not be recognized or reported. The practitioners' use of shared instruments is thought to aid the transmission of hepatitis B, hepatitis C and HIV, although no epidemiological studies have shown this.[61]:50

All You Need To Know About FGM | End FGM - YouTube

Female Genital Mutilation Rises In UK | FGM "Parties" | No Prosecutions - YouTube


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