Warcraft II Forum

Warcraft II => Cartography & Custom Maps => Topic started by: Erenussocrates on May 20, 2016, 04:26:39 AM

Title: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: Erenussocrates on May 20, 2016, 04:26:39 AM
Hello everyone, I've started a new project recently. I'm modifying the missions that I've extracted from war2dat.mpq (credit goes to tupac for telling me how to extract them some months ago). Since warcraft 2 didn't have a difficulty option, the idea is to modify the maps in a way that it certainly makes it more difficult to finish them compared to how they normally are. These modifications will include: adding more enemy factions and units in the maps, altering the terrain and resources, changing mission objectives. And it also includes ever so slightly changes to unit stats to make human vs. orc slightly more balanced. (if you do not like it, I can revert it back)
I've just recently started today and only modified the first 3 maps from Human Beyond The Dark Portal campaign. So the work is still beta. But I would like you to test and critisize the changes, and tell me how it is, so I'm putting these 3 maps here anyways.

Well since we don't have a trigger editor yet, we will have to obviously play them through custom game, and when I release the full version I will include a text file to mention mission objectives as well. But who knows maybe that could change sometime in the future *winks at tupac lol*

Unit changes (humans only): Added +10 base hp, +1 base armor, +1 base damage and +1 piercing damage to Paladins. (not applied to knights)
Added +1 base armor, +1 attack range, +1 base damage and +1 piercing damage to Rangers. (not applied to archers)


I will be including the beta as attachment to this post. Please try it out and tell me about what you think. Btw, sorry if a project like this had been posted in these forums before x'D

The objectives in all first 3 missions are the same with their original counterparts. (mission 1: all heroes survive and bring them to circle of power , mission 2: destroy all enemy forces and danath must survive , mission 3: destroy all strongholds and fortresses and bring turalyon to the circle of power)

Update: Added 3 more missions, and tweaked the previous 3. All of which retain the same mission objective as the originals did.
(Mission 4: erect a castle to protect the portal, destroy all enemy forces
Mission 5: Build three shipyards, destroy all orcish shipyards
Mission 6: Turalyon and Danath must return to the Circle of Power after destroying Bleeding Hollow (orange) )

Go, give them hell.
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: Warchief Lightbringer- on May 20, 2016, 07:32:04 AM
Just load and play the map? How to test those?
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: Winchester on May 20, 2016, 08:21:17 AM
Would you be able to create a 2-player version of the campaigns without adding much? Such as 2 gold mines but with half the gold in each as the single player version, or maybe 5k extra or so just so its not too much gold extra for the multi. And on missions where you start with alot of units, give half to one person and other half to other, without adding any extra units?

I've asked some frequent custom players in the past if they had any maps or could create any maps like this in the past but didn't really get much out of it.

Your project is cool though and hope it all works out!
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: Erenussocrates on May 20, 2016, 09:39:02 AM
@Warchief Lightbringer-:

Yeah, ofcourse. Just put it in maps section and play in custom game. Though, just a reminder, there are no triggers so every map is by default set to destroy all your enemies. So, you just have to pretend that you won when you reach the satisfactory conditions of the original missions :P

@Winchester:

That sounds like a cool idea. I wouldn't implement it in this particular map series though. But I will definitely start working on it, as another map series. But, again... Since there is a lack of triggers, they will all just be "eliminate your enemies" maps again, but you can just pretend that you've won when you and your friend meets the satisfactory conditions of original mission.
But there's that problem, I have no idea how rescue passive works when you are playing together with another human. If you, or anyone else tells me what happens in that situation, I might have a better idea about how to implement things in maps.
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: tupac on May 20, 2016, 03:24:15 PM
Very good man keep it up! Once you feel bored with this you can mess with the AI if you wanted to and totally control how the computer plays Warcraft and even combine that AI to a map also. Its maybe even easier to do then edit a map. Anyways Great work ill check them out when i can i haven't played war2 in awhile.

Note: Passive rescue units are very simple and you must be allied to every human player in the game and rescue all the units of course these conditions can be counted if you added dark portal which would need destroyed, or circle of power which you return a rescue unit to. Don't forget get to kill all enemies also then the game should get a win with all those requirements met.

Well at least what i can remember.
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: easycompany on May 20, 2016, 04:44:55 PM
im all for the campaign/comp maps...sounds fun and yeah ai would be cool to mess with.
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: Erenussocrates on May 21, 2016, 01:36:01 AM
@tupac, yeah, but by messing with AI if you mean creating my own AI packages, I definitely have no idea how to do that :p I can just implement the preexisting AI packages in PUDDraft, like for example, putting the blue computer AI of I dunno, tides of darkness orc mission 11 into the AI of orange orc in beyond the dark portal human mission 1 or something like that. Yeah, I can do that, and I've already kinda did that in these beta missions and will continue to do so in further maps as well :P It's no big deal.

But, does the first human who touches the rescue passive unit gain the control, or do they gain control over them simultaneously? (both being able to control the same rescue unit?) Or just the first human player in players list being able to control the rescue units for example? What I'm wondering is how that does work.

Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: tupac on May 21, 2016, 12:35:43 PM
https://web.archive.org/web/20150424013642/http://www.warlords-of-warcraft2.com/index.php/new-computer-ai (https://web.archive.org/web/20150424013642/http://www.warlords-of-warcraft2.com/index.php/new-computer-ai)

Most pictures are broken but it's very simple process once setup. Need a copy of wardraft, warcraft 2 dos data files, knowledge files, once those are setup boom wardraft is ready and now you can pretty much edit anything in warcraft 2 dos.

Now you might be thinking what about ru/bnet war2. Easy someone discovered the file you extract and edit in wardraft forgot off my head but it's mentioned in the tutorial linked above. So once you done editing the AI code just rename the file to ai.bin and place in the mpq for war2 bnet.

Sample of what you would be editing below. AI code

Quote
1. The AI code
#include aidefs.inc

Program:
build nothing          ; build nothing
reset_land             ; reset land attack trigger
reset_water            ; reset naval attack trigger
reset_air              ; reset air attack trigger
strat_on               ; ? strategy on ?
aggr_low               ; ? low aggressiveness ?
build townhall         ; Town Hall
peasants     = 36      ; set # Peasants
build barracks         ; Barracks
footmen      = 4       ; set # Footmen
ptys_land    = 1       ; set number of land attack parties
size_land    = 4       ; set size of land attack party
wait_land              ; wait until land attack parties are complete
size_land    = 1       ; set size of land attack party
attk_land              ; start land attack
sleep 360
build barracks         ; Barracks
build barracks         ; Barracks
footmen      = 6       ; set # Footmen
ptys_land    = 1       ; set number of land attack parties
size_land    = 6       ; set size of land attack party
wait_land              ; wait until land attack parties are complete
size_land    = 2       ; set size of land attack party
attk_land              ; start land attack
build lumbermill       ; Lumber mill
build blacksmith       ; Blacksmith
build tower            ; Scout Tower
build tower            ; Scout Tower
upgrd up_keep          ; upgrade Townhall to Keep
upgrd up_footmen_A1    ; Footman,Knight upgrade A (1/2)
upgrd up_arrow_1       ; Arrow upgrade (1/2)
footmen      = 9       ; set # Footmen
ptys_land    = 1       ; set number of land attack parties
size_land    = 9       ; set size of land attack party
wait_land              ; wait until land attack parties are complete
size_land    = 3       ; set size of land attack party
attk_land              ; start land attack
wait_keep              ; wait until you have a Keep



Also for the passive units forgot exactly how it worked but would be very simple to test. I think a passive neutral unit anyone can rescue, but if a player between 0 and 7 you need to rescue the townhall or first units they started with to capture the whole base. Might be a little off but simple to figure out.


Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: Erenussocrates on May 21, 2016, 04:41:44 PM
I see, thanks for sharing that too. It's interesting. It seems to work for all of the maps and you have to mod the maindat.war in order for it to work, instead of working in just specific .puds and not requiring you to mod the maindat.war, which probably would be the preferable thing :(

Btw, do you know how to use the campaign builder in wardraft? Is there a tutorial for that too?
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: tupac on May 21, 2016, 10:36:30 PM
Yeah its also a standalone wcm.exe. umm don't really know much about it. But seems basic and would only work for war2 dos. Unless we can get rid of that error on bnet version.
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: pasildan on July 29, 2016, 11:16:45 AM
Okay... I'm going to post this before I loss this mix between madness and happyness.
This is the most fucking hard mission I have ever played in warcraft 2.... My right hand is completely demolished due to this hard mode missions... I required 2 days practicing the mission 2 human, beyond the dark portal.
So finally I made it done and I can say... it's INCREDIBLY FUCKING HARD!!  I finished it killing around 400 orcs, can't believe how hard & fun can be a mission on this game with the correct AI.
My god man , this couple of hours were exhausting as hell. I cannot believe I was able to finish it... The hordes of orcs are unlimited in mission 2... I'm going to take a rest before testing mission 3 but hey, you made a really good job for mission 2... mission 1 was hard for being the start and I like it too much as well.

But mission 2 is a complete challenge for everyone who is searching pretty high speed gameplay. You are being attacked in 2-3-4 places at once. I needed to rush as fast as possible paladins & blizzards, at least that's my strategy... Please keep doing the rest of missions for humans- dark portal campaign.
I would be super amazing to see the entire game in hard mode for 4 campaigns in the future... Already dark portal orcs campaign it's pretty hard, even for these days... I really so much that campaign because it was really well designed in terms of skills for even that ages.

Thank you again man! Really enjoyed mission 2.
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: easycompany on July 29, 2016, 12:17:07 PM
back when i was messing with trying to customize units...i did make a pud, cpu sent every unit it made to attack(no wait) but the pud was hacked to sheet and no way i could find out what i done :(

probably a unused old blizzard setup.

keep up the good work!
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: pasildan on July 29, 2016, 12:55:29 PM
The only thing I may suggest in mission 2. Could you place the second mine next to your base a little bit better positionated? I mean, workers get trapped next to the rocks because of the mine position and increase a little bit the amount of gold in that second mine because even if I managed to complete your mission 2, I killed 388 orcs and lossing around 15 units, you have to manage incredibly well your units and loss as few units as possible to complete the mission. Good job done again!
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: easycompany on July 29, 2016, 01:33:53 PM
try out these aggressive always lvl1  :P(they do upgrade playing in bnet to lvl 3 before i died)

lol cant use that one the computer is attacking another!!!!!wth!!

comps fight each other in ffa?? lol no wonder me and other dude is still alive and gowbne pathing is terrible!'

yes the comps do attack each other in ffa didnt know this!!
i couldnt beat 4 i tried :( good luck on the scenerios maybe some kinda hacked in ai will be of use.
still weaksauce in multi they just foot archers and ballistas. they whoop my ass in single though and guard tower up almost to great.
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: pasildan on July 30, 2016, 04:00:10 PM
Just completed your mission 3 hard and it's tremendously exhausting... I was launching the attack in sea once green , red and purple ran out of resources... it was really fun in the beginning but once the computer get out of money do nothing. Anyway was a really fun beginning on the mission. I may suggest removing death knights around ground area before joining sea because they take too much time to attack orange, so you finally take a lot of time more to complete the mission. I may suggest too removing green player and adding Sea transports for orc purple, so the mission doesn't take for ever to complete and it keeps getting a lot of fun/difficulty.
But this is my opinion. Great job with missions 1 , 2 and 3 !
Regards
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: Erenussocrates on August 01, 2016, 09:03:56 AM
Honestly I'm impressed that you were able to finish those two hard missions. And even with very little losses too. Because, even though I created them, I was unable to win the scenarios that I created myself, except for the easier first one x'D That being said, while keeping them hard, I still tried my best to make them as realistically managable as possible, i.e not impossible to beat. But I was still not good enough to beat my own missions, but you were good enough to beat them it seems :P I kinda wish that there was a youtube video of you beating them, so I could also inspect the videos and take notes about how to beat them myself, lol.

Thank you for suggestions, I will implement them, and I will post the new updated maps along with the new hard missions when I post the new link.
Btw, about mission 3, which deathknights do you wish to be removed? There are three groups guarding the mainland. The ones guarding the western gold mine, the ones hidden south of orange base, and a small one hidden north of the orange base. Maybe you can take a screenshot of the one you wish to be removed?
About purple, I kinda don't want to change the original AI of purple in this mission, because if I remember correctly they were the ones sending dragons, and I want at least one base to be able to send dragons in this mission. But I can try to nerf green if you want? I hope it doesn't become too easy to defend though.

Btw, thanks for your suggestions and feedback. I feel encouraged to continue working on more mission again now.
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: Erenussocrates on August 01, 2016, 12:11:39 PM
Sorry for long delay and sorry for flooding. Here is the new version of the human BtDP campaign. Goldmine in mission 2 is relocated to a place tiny bit souther, and added 5000~ gold (if I recall correctly). Green in mission 3 is nerfed. If I'm not wrong, they shouldn't be sending in ogres, atleast?

On top of that, added 3 more missions. All of which retain the same mission objective as the original did.
(Mission 4: erect a castle to protect the portal, destroy all enemy forces
Mission 5: Build three shipyards, destroy all orcish shipyards
Mission 6: Turalyon and Danath must return to the Circle of Power after destroying Bleeding Hollow (orange) )

Go, give them hell.

Note: I will also update the original post by posting the updated version.
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: pasildan on August 02, 2016, 05:37:34 AM
Sorry for long delay and sorry for flooding. Here is the new version of the human BtDP campaign. Goldmine in mission 2 is relocated to a place tiny bit souther, and added 5000~ gold (if I recall correctly). Green in mission 3 is nerfed. If I'm not wrong, they shouldn't be sending in ogres, atleast?

On top of that, added 3 more missions. All of which retain the same mission objective as the original did.
(Mission 4: erect a castle to protect the portal, destroy all enemy forces
Mission 5: Build three shipyards, destroy all orcish shipyards
Mission 6: Turalyon and Danath must return to the Circle of Power after destroying Bleeding Hollow (orange) )

Go, give them hell.

Note: I will also update the original post by posting the updated version.
Honestly I'm impressed that you were able to finish those two hard missions. And even with very little losses too. Because, even though I created them, I was unable to win the scenarios that I created myself, except for the easier first one x'D That being said, while keeping them hard, I still tried my best to make them as realistically managable as possible, i.e not impossible to beat. But I was still not good enough to beat my own missions, but you were good enough to beat them it seems :P I kinda wish that there was a youtube video of you beating them, so I could also inspect the videos and take notes about how to beat them myself, lol.

Thank you for suggestions, I will implement them, and I will post the new updated maps along with the new hard missions when I post the new link.
Btw, about mission 3, which deathknights do you wish to be removed? There are three groups guarding the mainland. The ones guarding the western gold mine, the ones hidden south of orange base, and a small one hidden north of the orange base. Maybe you can take a screenshot of the one you wish to be removed?
About purple, I kinda don't want to change the original AI of purple in this mission, because if I remember correctly they were the ones sending dragons, and I want at least one base to be able to send dragons in this mission. But I can try to nerf green if you want? I hope it doesn't become too easy to defend though.

Btw, thanks for your suggestions and feedback. I feel encouraged to continue working on more mission again now.
Honestly I'm impressed that you were able to finish those two hard missions. And even with very little losses too. Because, even though I created them, I was unable to win the scenarios that I created myself, except for the easier first one x'D That being said, while keeping them hard, I still tried my best to make them as realistically managable as possible, i.e not impossible to beat. But I was still not good enough to beat my own missions, but you were good enough to beat them it seems :P I kinda wish that there was a youtube video of you beating them, so I could also inspect the videos and take notes about how to beat them myself, lol.

Thank you for suggestions, I will implement them, and I will post the new updated maps along with the new hard missions when I post the new link.
Btw, about mission 3, which deathknights do you wish to be removed? There are three groups guarding the mainland. The ones guarding the western gold mine, the ones hidden south of orange base, and a small one hidden north of the orange base. Maybe you can take a screenshot of the one you wish to be removed?
About purple, I kinda don't want to change the original AI of purple in this mission, because if I remember correctly they were the ones sending dragons, and I want at least one base to be able to send dragons in this mission. But I can try to nerf green if you want? I hope it doesn't become too easy to defend though.

Btw, thanks for your suggestions and feedback. I feel encouraged to continue working on more mission again now.


I can make some streaming for you if you are interested :D , send me a private message if interested on it. I can do it into the next days playing mission 1 2 and 3 hard mode
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: pasildan on August 02, 2016, 05:41:36 AM
Sorry for long delay and sorry for flooding. Here is the new version of the human BtDP campaign. Goldmine in mission 2 is relocated to a place tiny bit souther, and added 5000~ gold (if I recall correctly). Green in mission 3 is nerfed. If I'm not wrong, they shouldn't be sending in ogres, atleast?

On top of that, added 3 more missions. All of which retain the same mission objective as the original did.
(Mission 4: erect a castle to protect the portal, destroy all enemy forces
Mission 5: Build three shipyards, destroy all orcish shipyards
Mission 6: Turalyon and Danath must return to the Circle of Power after destroying Bleeding Hollow (orange) )

Go, give them hell.

Note: I will also update the original post by posting the updated version.

Everything you said about improves is correct, excepting to nerf green orcs. I was telling you about taking too much time to kill every single tower/farm . So in the end it takes too much time to complete the mission. The attacks from green it's pretty ok. Oh and I was telling you about death knights both around orange base. I don't think they are necessary but it's just my opinion :D . I will try missions 4-6 around these days. If you wants I can make a streaming for you to show missions 1-6 how to beat :D. Regards
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: Erenussocrates on August 02, 2016, 12:49:28 PM
Alright pm sent :P

Btw, I can make further changes to the previous maps and fix the things that are still prevalent, but I also wanna decide that after watching you how you handle the maps.
Title: Re: Map series: Campaign Hard Mode
Post by: salvadorc17 on August 02, 2016, 03:41:46 PM
Good work. Hell, youre so really crazied doing this, mission 4 is big work, it will took like an hour to complete.