Warcraft II Forum

Warcraft II => Server.War2.ru => Topic started by: tk[as] on October 03, 2018, 03:47:35 PM

Title: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: tk[as] on October 03, 2018, 03:47:35 PM
He doesn't realize that by attacking the server he is just getting people to stop playing War II. Very few people are going to migrate over to your server Tupac. And by the time you are done with your attack your server will still be unsuccessful and there will be fewer War 2 players then when you started your attack. You're literally just killing the game. You are not accomplishing anything
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: ~ToRa~ on October 03, 2018, 04:08:01 PM
I don’t think he cares.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: BabyShark on October 03, 2018, 04:11:36 PM
I would like to see some evidence that Tupac is responsible for what is going on at ru.

Anyone could just as easily say "TK stop killing the game! Don't do it TK! Stop attacking ru!"

Tupac isn't dumb enough to sabotage his own server this way.

The attacks are being done by someone within ru who wants to malign the new server. Everyone who wants it to stop, including me, should pool together some money to hire an unbiased professional computer expert who can find out who did it, and the person who did it should be perm banned from W2, even if it was Swift.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: Certified MENSA Genius Brain (smart) on October 03, 2018, 04:18:35 PM
The attacks are being done by someone within ru who wants to malign the new server.
This is such a stupid theory.  You can't really believe that.  The server has been crippled for 10 days... the idea that we'd own ourselves for multiple weeks in some ridiculous false flag attack is absurd.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: woofy on October 03, 2018, 04:19:05 PM
you can't convince this retard anything. people are saying "uh i don't think it's him" but it obviously is him. the illegal kiddiescipt attacks makes him think he's some sort of 1337 superh4x0r overlord

someone banned him on the server last week and he jumps on discord blaming me "he's going to regret that". stupid clown, gtfoh with your baseless shitty internet threats ;D

babyshark, shove your evidence up your ass and gtfoh also. you guys are seriously (seriously) deranged
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: Certified MENSA Genius Brain (smart) on October 03, 2018, 04:22:40 PM
It's obviously either Tupac or Archer, because historically I think it's been them literally 100% of the time.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: woofy on October 03, 2018, 04:23:15 PM
You seem to be obsessed with swift.


you're so fucking right dude
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: tk[as] on October 03, 2018, 04:25:19 PM
there are only like 4 people in the last 7-8 years who have the desire/ability to engage in attacks like these.. not that they're extremely complicated.. but very few players have the desire to do it.

tupac is the only player with the motive/"ability" to make the attack when he made it... the other 3 would have absolutely no reason to. they dont even hardly play any more... and when they do play they seem to be enjoying themselves and the server.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: tk[as] on October 03, 2018, 04:26:06 PM
if archer is doing it, its in cahoots with tupac
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: tk[as] on October 03, 2018, 04:27:57 PM
I may be mistaken.. but tupac tried launching this server a few years ago as well.. and I'm pretty confident the attacks happened during his last launch.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: BabyShark on October 03, 2018, 04:30:19 PM
No one at ru seems interested in finding out who actually did it. That's interesting.

If no one at ru wants to find out, it could be that you already know and it's one of your own. Or you really are that brainwashed by someone who is known to be dishonest and malicious.

What's absurd is the idea that Tupac would spend tons of money and time and effort to create a nice new W2 server for people to play on and then sabotage its reputation by acting untrustworthy. I'll repeat again: Tupac knows no one is joining anything by force. Pinning this on Tupac is silly.

I get that you people are pissed off. But you're pissed off at the wrong people.

Treating me rudely shows more about you than it does about me.

If you wanna know why ru has had about 20-30 average users logged on at a time instead of a lot more after who knows how many years of operation, look at yourselves and the way you treat people.

No matter how angry you get, or how many names you call me, or how many times you falsely accuse people without evidence, or who you ban, or even who you kill, lies won't become true.



Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: tk[as] on October 03, 2018, 04:33:52 PM
There are like 40 active users on the server. It's not like it's some big mystery
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: woofy on October 03, 2018, 04:42:26 PM
No one at ru seems interested in finding out who actually did it. That's interesting.

If no one at ru wants to find out, it could be that you already know and it's one of your own. Or you really are that brainwashed by someone who is known to be dishonest and malicious.

What's absurd is the idea that Tupac would spend tons of money and time and effort to create a nice new W2 server for people to play on and then sabotage its reputation by acting untrustworthy. I'll repeat again: Tupac knows no one is joining anything by force. Pinning this on Tupac is silly.

I get that you people are pissed off. But you're pissed off at the wrong people.

Treating me rudely shows more about you than it does about me.

If you wanna know why ru has had about 20-30 average users logged on at a time instead of a lot more after who knows how many years of operation, look at yourselves and the way you treat people.

No matter how angry you get, or how many names you call me, or how many times you falsely accuse people without evidence, or who you ban, or even who you kill, lies won't become true.






every single 1000-word essay you wrote to me on discord had 3 main points:

* we're all brainwashed (huh? we just want to relax and play a computer game after work)
* lord swift owns us all here and will stop at nothing to end usa.war2 or whatever-the-hell-that-server-nobody-cares-about-is-called
* everything is a conspiracy

literally. this is what you would post to me in those super-long messages, days on end. and i haven't said anything up until now but all of your public posts to others are exactly the same format.

heed my advice babyshark, gtfoh. war2 is making you batshitcrazy
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: BabyShark on October 03, 2018, 05:00:59 PM
Nah. I'm not the one who is crazy here.

I'm not the one calling for people to be put to death because they are black or because I can't play a video game.

I look at evidence and consider various possibilities and come to the most rational conclusion.

It is not rational for Tupac to spend the amount of money, time, and work on his server that he has, only to sabotage it.

He's a smart guy and that would be a retarded move.

It *is* rational to conclude that someone got pissed off that some people want to play W2 elsewhere and wanted to try to damage the other server's reputation.

A person who specifically messaged me on ru server saying he will put $5000 into making sure the new server fails was Swift. He then goes on a public smear campaign against me. You have the most likely suspect right there.



Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: woofy on October 03, 2018, 05:04:17 PM
so instead of attacking us.warcraft.2.com or whatever it is, they attack .ru

yes, babyshark. you should be a detective  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: woofy on October 03, 2018, 05:05:46 PM
and i never said van wasn't crazy, he is. and so are you.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: BabyShark on October 03, 2018, 05:27:01 PM
Crazy has two definitions:

Crazy - mentally deranged, especially as manifested in a wild or aggressive way
          - extremely enthusiastic

I am occasionally enthusiastic, but nothing I have said or done here reflects someone who is mentally deranged or "wild" or "aggressive".

Asking for evidence of accusations is not crazy. It's rational. Sensible people want evidence before they swallow up claims and want to stone people to death.

You seem so angry that you're ready to blow up, but your anger isn't directed at the person who is actually responsible for attacking ru. I know for a fact I have nothing to do with it, nor do I know who it is. I only have a strong suspicion based on someone's expressed motive to destroy War2Usa and the amount of money he wanted to instill into that attack.

www.war2usa.com (http://www.war2usa.com) has been attacked over 7000 times in the last month. We are under heavy attack. Someone doesn't want us to play W2 somewhere else for whatever reason.

(https://i.imgur.com/0l7J401.png)

You being rude to me though I've done nothing to you shows your character more than mine.

Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: woofy on October 03, 2018, 05:32:22 PM
i'm angry at your willful ignorance
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: BabyShark on October 03, 2018, 05:34:46 PM
If you want to convince me of some truth, bring evidence.

For starters, explain to me why someone would invest tons of time and money into building a server, only to sabotage it and destroy its reputation by attacking ru. Explain that one to me.

People will not join by force. That's a known fact. Anyone who plays there plays there because they want to be there and it's a fun place to be with fun and nice people.

Attacking me or being rude to me is only going to convince me that you're a mean person to people who have never been rude to you.

Like I said, I am willing to donate to the cause of hiring an unbiased professional computer expert to track down who actually did this.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: ~ToRa~ on October 03, 2018, 05:37:11 PM
Attacking me or being rude to me is only going to convince me that you're a mean person to people who have never been rude to you.

This girl takes insults on the internet very seriously.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: BabyShark on October 03, 2018, 05:40:21 PM
Attacking me or being rude to me is only going to convince me that you're a mean person to people who have never been rude to you.

This girl takes insults on the internet very seriously.


I'm not the one flipping my top and wanting to put people to death because I can't play a video game.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: Cel on October 03, 2018, 05:47:01 PM
Even if it is not him doing the attack he still showed us his true colors by saying:

"I hope the attacks never end"

Thus supporting what is undoubtedly a destructive and very stupid action had it be done to any server.

Tupac is encouraging it and actively trying to use it to his own profit by misleading people to believe his thing is an official solution to the problems people encounter because for the attacks.
I have proof for all that  here: http://forum.war2.ru/index.php/topic,4480.0.html (http://forum.war2.ru/index.php/topic,4480.0.html)

Now he must know there are no safe place on the internet I've seen him make some pretty nasty comments and threats on here too.

"@XuRnT What happend last time you choose to fuck with me? That didn't end to well for you did it?"

Apparently threatening to hack into other user's computers namely Xurnt and implying he should shut up because what?
He is going to do that again, is that what he is implying here?
Is there any case scenario were that is acceptable on your so called non-toxic server?
Would that be qualifying as bullying and toxic enough for you?

If someone in your server has hacked an other user and threaten him to do it again would you say it is cool and perfectly non-toxic?
Maybe you should ban that toxic player from his own server he clearly cant be in contact with 13 years old lol.

Oh yeah, smart guy indeed, Tupac is definitely showing that through his restraint and perfectly acceptable behavior... <= sarcasm

All I said are not just blank accusations, these are facts now you can choose to say you think these facts do not matter and are irrelevant to you.
But understand that many will think that they are far from irrelevant and should be taken into consideration when ever him or that server is mentioned.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: XuRnT on October 03, 2018, 05:55:41 PM
+1 tk for admin
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: woofy on October 03, 2018, 05:56:58 PM
If you want to convince me of some truth, bring evidence.

For starters, explain to me why someone would invest tons of time and money into building a server, only to sabotage it and destroy its reputation by attacking ru. Explain that one to me.

People will not join by force. That's a known fact. Anyone who plays there plays there because they want to be there and it's a fun place to be with fun and nice people.

Attacking me or being rude to me is only going to convince me that you're a mean person to people who have never been rude to you.

Like I said, I am willing to donate to the cause of hiring an unbiased professional computer expert to track down who actually did this.

what? you kept saying on discord private messages how brainwashed i am, and i was in cahoots with swift, and that i was evil for "unjustly banning" deathknight. like, not just one message but the spiel was repeated over a course of weeks. so one day i thought "fuckit", pulled in my chair, took 10 minutes out of my busy work/life/war2 schedule and addressed all of your points. in that message i addressed your points so well it could have been used to solve the hunger crisis in africa, be the answer to world peace, or even *wait for it* motivate you to see things clearly through that fog-of-war going on in your head. nope. didn't work. still just a bunch of peons in there walking around aimlessly with sacks of gold and no townhall

also, why are you defending tupac so bad? you do know he's openly admitted to attacking the server before, right? i was made channel mod to help get rid of tupac's floodbots (that he admitted were his) and dellam years ago. he also openly admitted to attacking burnt's computer in a thread just yesterday, openly threatening me for being banned on the server just a few days ago (i didn't ban him). so weird that you think the sun shines from his ass. truly baffling

whatevs. sg was right, maybe it is just an attention thing after all
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: BabyShark on October 03, 2018, 06:03:46 PM
@Cel

When people are falsely accused, unjustly muted, unjustly banned, they understandably tend to get a little crotchety.

If you had people lying about you and wishing you dead for things you didn't do, and then they slipped on their own vomit and bonked their head, how sorry for them would you feel?

I am offering to help find out who actually did this, but it seems no one at ru really wants to know, which means either they already know, or are too brainwashed to think straight to realize Tupac wouldn't sabotage his own server like this.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: ~ToRa~ on October 03, 2018, 06:09:34 PM
If you had people lying about you and wishing you dead for things you didn't do, and then they slipped on their own vomit and bonked their head, how sorry for them would you feel?

This is a game it’s not real life.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: Cel on October 03, 2018, 06:20:17 PM
@LiveFreeorDie
If a convicted murderer makes death threats to a person because that person insulted him (Burnt made accusations here nothing more it could be taken as an insult nothing more).
Do you take it seriously? Do you put him under restraining order or not?
Do you try to justify his actions because, that man really pushed him and hey maybe he was not serious about it?
Do you give that convicted murderer the benefit of the doubt?

This is worse than some random racial insult on a public chat this is a real case of bullying toxicity there is no undermining it, I am sorry it has to be taken seriously.
And Tupac wanted Xurnt to take that threat seriously there is no denying that.

We wont ever know who is really behind the attacks there is simply no way for us without server access to prove it and even if we had these we would need a lot more resources to expose him than he needs to attack us.

What we can talk about though is how this guy behaves regarding the community and if he effectively is acting in a way that will harm the community.

And I am sorry he is not a child he should be able to behave other than just out of anger or whatever especially when he has that history.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: BabyShark on October 03, 2018, 06:22:47 PM
also, why are you defending tupac so bad? you do know he's openly admitted to attacking the server before, right? i was made channel mod to help get rid of tupac's floodbots (that he admitted were his) and dellam years ago. he also openly admitted to attacking burnt's computer in a thread just yesterday, openly threatening me for being banned on the server just a few days ago (i didn't ban him). so weird that you think the sun shines from his ass. truly baffling

I don't know what transpired around here when I wasn't playing.

What I've heard is that Tupac was playing Free Castles with Burnt. Burnt lost and banned him from ru when he was young because Burnt did not like losing. And Tupac didn't like that.

Maybe there was some kind of pissed off response to being treated badly in the past, I don't know, I wasn't there.

We can delve into everyone's history and rattle out some skeletons. How many ru players have a criminal background? How many are drug addicts?

If you ban everyone who has ever done anything in their lives that someone could frown upon, you'd ban every single last person that's ever lived.

We are looking at the current situation, what's happening right now. I don't know Dellam. I don't know Archer. I've heard the names, but I had no awareness of anything going on. But if occasionally someone who knows some computer stuff gets bullied and harassed by toxic people to the point where they want to get back at the rude people, that wouldn't surprise me too much. And it wouldn't be fair to pin full blame on the parties who were brought to that point while ignoring the bullies who pressed them to it.

If you'd like to show me the thread(s) where these transpired, I'll give them a glance to get a feel for what went down.

But that isn't what happened here.

Tupac put a lot of time and work into making a nice W2 server for people to play on, investing his own money into the project. It's not logical for him to sabotage his own project. It just isn't.

You have people wishing me dead for things I didn't do, so I know how it feels to be wrongfully accused. If I find myself getting angry at people and wanting revenge, I take it to God. God knows who did what and God is the source of peace and joy, and can replace sore and angry feelings with compassion, kindness, patience, gentleness, self-control. God tells us to pray for enemies, and I do. And it has power.

Love is more powerful than hate.

Forgiveness is more powerful than revenge.

I choose kindness, not because I don't know how to be mean, but because God chose kindness towards me in spite of my not deserving it.

openly threatening me for being banned on the server just a few days ago (i didn't ban him).

According to your own logic, you did ban him. Your logic states that if someone ever did something, then they did it every time it happened. Therefore you banned Tupac.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: woofy on October 03, 2018, 06:32:58 PM
openly threatening me for being banned on the server just a few days ago (i didn't ban him).

According to your own logic, you did ban him. Your logic states that if someone ever did something, then they did it every time it happened. Therefore you banned Tupac.


yeah i skimmed past your standard willful ignorance and just saw this. sums up your thinking really - straightup cuckoo
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: Cel on October 03, 2018, 06:44:41 PM
Alright so you are saying hey we cant ban all convicted criminals they were punished already I agree!

But are you saying threats coming from a convicted criminal of the same kind have not to be taken seriously?
Are you saying if a convicted criminal shows you his record and tells you you are next it is the same as if some random guy does it and has nothing to back it up?
Why then would he even mention it then if it has no importance? Because it is relevant!

Now I am not saying you should judge him for the skeletons in the closet but you should based on what he does now with that skeleton.
In my country and in yours too if a convicted murderer makes death threats he is under restraining order there is no question asked this is just straight mechanical for a good reason.

Are you saying your non-toxic server is accepting that level of toxicity after all, is that what you are saying?
According to your server and it's policy harrassing someone and threatening him with proof that you can do it and all is ok?
Or are you making an exception here just for that one person?

And dont tell me he acted on his feelings and anger we are not talking about a 14 years old that has hormones issues here.
The guy is litteraly the server admin and talk here in your server's name.
I think I am not being unfair here.
He is really not doing things right and I think you should honestly realize that.
And yes, no one is perfect but this is beyond that.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: XuRnT on October 03, 2018, 07:02:17 PM
What I've heard is that Tupac was playing Free Castles with Burnt. Burnt lost and banned him from ru when he was young because Burnt did not like losing. And Tupac didn't like that.


I'll leave this here as well

Set up one of your $$ prize challenges and you can find out how far out of my league he is. We can do it on mousetophers server, two watchers streaming the players to watch for macros. You and mousetopher watch. Don't worry he won't play me and let his lies be exposed.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: woofy on October 03, 2018, 07:19:55 PM
she fails to see tupac is still threatening people. everyone needs to stop giving her attention
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: ~ToRa~ on October 03, 2018, 07:24:49 PM
she fails to see tupac is still threatening people. everyone needs to stop giving her attention
+1 dont feed the troll people.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: tk[as] on October 03, 2018, 09:56:14 PM
I sont think she's trolling.. I think she is so disconnected from reality she is blind to it..

but none the less, nothing productive will ever be accomplished by attempting to have a meaningful discussion with Babyshark .. she literally has some serious emotional/psychological issues, and were all aware of it
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: Shotgun on October 03, 2018, 11:09:31 PM
you can't convince this retard anything. people are saying "uh i don't think it's him" but it obviously is him. the illegal kiddiescipt attacks makes him think he's some sort of 1337 superh4x0r overlord

someone banned him on the server last week and he jumps on discord blaming me "he's going to regret that". stupid clown, gtfoh with your baseless shitty internet threats ;D

babyshark, shove your evidence up your ass and gtfoh also. you guys are seriously (seriously) deranged
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: Winchester on October 04, 2018, 04:28:27 AM
Here we go again, Babyshark is rambling about god again whilst attacking me days earlier for mentioning a leap of faith. The whole premise of her gods existence. Faith.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: mousEtopher on October 04, 2018, 12:13:29 PM
They can't stop themselves from reading the posts here and responding here when their names are mentioned.

frankly this goes both ways. the only thing babyshark & tupac are for-sure guilty of here is leaving bait that everyone is unable to stop themselves from taking. banning them doesn't solve anything, it just makes you all feel slightly better about the fact that ru is getting straight-up owned and we're powerless to stop it. sure whoever is attacking the server is a huge weirdo creep, but in all honesty it's not a very strong attack & it's only been possible because ru is a dilapidated pile of crap with no systems in place for dealing with it, no chain of command, no way to delegate access, etc. the way the server is running now is untenable & this is a wake up call to that fact, we can either pull together as a community to deal with it or continue to shove our problems under the rug & pretend that's going to solve anything.

instead of all this gratuitous name calling & finger pointing, why dont we instead discuss pooling resources & finding a real solution?

i think it's clear that what is needed is to 1. update to the latest version of pvpgn which will immediately give us a lot more features/options, especially to control spam registrations 2. get more access to more people to maintain & run the server, or if that's not possible set up a new collaborative development server that can eventually replace the current one, 3. get access to war2combat to people other than iL, who's greatly diminished level of involvement makes it impractical for him to continue operating as the sole project overseer. (Cel has even suggested the possibility of making everything open source to allow more contributions from more people, & more eyes to find and address exploits). there's lots of things we could be doing to deal with this, but as usual everyone is waiting for someone else to do them & thus collectively no one is making a move.


I sont think she's trolling.. I think she is so disconnected from reality she is blind to it..

but none the less, nothing productive will ever be accomplished by attempting to have a meaningful discussion with Babyshark .. she literally has some serious emotional/psychological issues, and were all aware of it

i agree that there's clearly no point trying to engage in anything approaching a reasoned, facts-based discussion with babyshark & it should be obvious to people by now that they should stop wasting their breath.


[url=http://www.war2usa.com]www.war2usa.com[/url] ([url]http://www.war2usa.com[/url]) has been attacked over 7000 times in the last month. We are under heavy attack. Someone doesn't want us to play W2 somewhere else for whatever reason.

([url]https://i.imgur.com/0l7J401.png[/url])

all wordpress websites experience ongoing brute force attacks on the default login page by bots that exist & constantly crawl the internet for solely that purpose, every wp website ive ever set up has similar statistics. it's not equivocal to the sort of attacks that have been happening to ru's pvpgn server
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: jordan4385 on October 04, 2018, 04:59:37 PM
You seem to be obsessed with swift.


you're so fucking right dude

She wants to dick swiftly
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: ~ToRa~ on October 17, 2018, 07:00:59 PM
Server may not be dead but I’ll say those attacks definitely lowered the user base.
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: Lambchops on October 17, 2018, 09:40:09 PM
If you had people lying about you and wishing you dead for things you didn't do, and then they slipped on their own vomit and bonked their head, how sorry for them would you feel?

lol nicely put.

frankly this goes both ways. the only thing babyshark & tupac are for-sure guilty of here is leaving bait that everyone is unable to stop themselves from taking. banning them doesn't solve anything, it just makes you all feel slightly better about the fact that ru is getting straight-up owned and we're powerless to stop it. sure whoever is attacking the server is a huge weirdo creep, but in all honesty it's not a very strong attack & it's only been possible because ru is a dilapidated pile of crap with no systems in place for dealing with it, no chain of command, no way to delegate access, etc. the way the server is running now is untenable & this is a wake up call to that fact, we can either pull together as a community to deal with it or continue to shove our problems under the rug & pretend that's going to solve anything.

instead of all this gratuitous name calling & finger pointing, why dont we instead discuss pooling resources & finding a real solution?

+10 sanity points for Mousey.


But I must say, you are never going to get a cohesive community with an administration that condones or even encourages extreme bullying and racism.

I also think a bot that instanly bans anyone that swears is a bit over the top, but I prefer that any day to a few snotty assholes getting celebrated for making a big show of being as vile and hateful as possible.

Surely there must be a happy medium somewhere? .... lets call it "sanity-land" lol.

Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: mousEtopher on October 18, 2018, 01:12:59 PM
frankly this goes both ways. the only thing babyshark & tupac are for-sure guilty of here is leaving bait that everyone is unable to stop themselves from taking. banning them doesn't solve anything, it just makes you all feel slightly better about the fact that ru is getting straight-up owned and we're powerless to stop it. sure whoever is attacking the server is a huge weirdo creep, but in all honesty it's not a very strong attack & it's only been possible because ru is a dilapidated pile of crap with no systems in place for dealing with it, no chain of command, no way to delegate access, etc. the way the server is running now is untenable & this is a wake up call to that fact, we can either pull together as a community to deal with it or continue to shove our problems under the rug & pretend that's going to solve anything.

instead of all this gratuitous name calling & finger pointing, why dont we instead discuss pooling resources & finding a real solution?

+10 sanity points for Mousey.


But I must say, you are never going to get a cohesive community with an administration that condones or even encourages extreme bullying and racism.

I also think a bot that instanly bans anyone that swears is a bit over the top, but I prefer that any day to a few snotty assholes getting celebrated for making a big show of being as vile and hateful as possible.

Surely there must be a happy medium somewhere? .... lets call it "sanity-land" lol.
:D idk man, it seems facile to reduce all ru's problems to the fact that it gives toxic people an equal right to use the server. there's so many other factors at play -- age & demographics of the players (older people with less time & less base familiarity with computer stuff to jump in & make contributions, not like all these young pups nowadays who grow up learning programming and making apps and crap) + all the many other barriers to entry like the age/obscurity of the game & the ocean of competing entertainment it's up against, pc compatibility issues, hosting issues, the learning curve of the game itself, etc, + the compounding of all these unaddressed issues over time (an ounce of prevention blah blah). undoubtedly we would have a larger community at this moment if so many players weren't so cliquish & exclusive to newbies, but that isn't really the same thing as the handful of ultra toxic people we're talking about & speaks to a larger problem (discussed below)

most likely war2 will never have a big initiative to update & modernize the server & playing experience since there's just not enough time/interest/ability/leadership available to pull it off; that's ok, it's good that it's available now (and for the most part holding together) for the small group of people who enjoy it & for whom it's nostalgic. (and frankly, anyone who thinks it really matters much either way is kidding themselves about the greater question of the tenability of 21st century capitalism for even another couple hundred years...)

personally, i also like the non-hypocrisy of allowing everyone the opportunity to play here. the modern mindset treats "toxic" people as if they are lesser human beings and takes great pleasure in ridiculing, shunning & ejecting them from on or offline communities. well, that's exactly the same thing that bigots are being shunned & rejected for doing, so how does that make sense? all this does is segregate human beings into two opposed populations that are constantly at each other's throats. when someone is so warped by the world they live in to have the kind of heinous & hateful attitudes that bigots have, the onus is on the rest of the (supposedly more "high-minded") population to not likewise stoop down to that same level (since it's apparently so easy to do & all these awful people should know better, right?) & instead do their best to understand & rehabilitate their peers. the only way to do that is by integrating & interacting with them, not by telling them to get the hell off your war2 lawn.

https://youtu.be/ORp3q1Oaezw

as an example, we've had great luck allowing everyone equal right to use the discord & also keeping it from devolving into a cesspool by simply availing ourselves of the modern permissions system it provides. that could easily be done in war2 too by upgrading to the latest version of pvpgn which seems to have much better muting features right out of the box

Server may not be dead but I’ll say those attacks definitely lowered the user base.
i doubt that, people who have played here for 10 years aren't going to just quit because they couldn't log in a few times. minor week-to-week fluctuations are hardly anything to go by
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: Certified MENSA Genius Brain (smart) on October 18, 2018, 01:28:27 PM
i mean i wouldnt mind regulating against some of the racist shit but i know that if we banned someone for it then immediately a dozen other fingers would get pointed saying this person said this thing, that person said that, amd while we could continue judging and making calls on all that stuff i dont think the players would enjoy being micromanaged that way whatsoever.

It's fine to shut down bigots though.  being "bigoted" against bigotry is a made up whine from racist people.  bigots aren't a protected or vulnerable class and being a bigot is not an immovable part of a person's identity
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: Yamon on October 18, 2018, 05:23:57 PM
what on earth am I looking at here?  ???
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: mousEtopher on October 24, 2018, 11:59:28 AM
It's fine to shut down bigots though.  being "bigoted" against bigotry is a made up whine from racist people.  bigots aren't a protected or vulnerable class and being a bigot is not an immovable part of a person's identity
disagree, it's entirely possible to oppose bigotry without employing it oneself. the problem rests entirely in the collectivized standards of culture being viewed as legitimization for having hateful/disparaging attitudes against x group of people, and this is clearly done on both sides. "hate" is a question of individual preference, so there's either the standard that it's acceptable to hate other human beings for arbitrary reasons, or there's not. you're either upholding this standard with the words & actions that you direct towards other people, or you're not. it's right & proper to oppose harmful attitudes & behaviors, but self-defeating to do it by dehumanizing & vilifying the individual.

nice to see you here again @Yamon !!
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: Certified MENSA Genius Brain (smart) on October 24, 2018, 12:39:48 PM
There's no such thing as "bigotry" against racism though, and it's not arbitrary to attack racists.  That doesnt make any sense and sounds more like it's coddling hate than rising above it.  Maybe im not understanding?
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: Every Billionaire is a Policy Failure on October 24, 2018, 12:59:37 PM
Quote from: Certified MENSA Genius Brain (smart)
It's fine to shut down bigots though.  being "bigoted" against bigotry is a made up whine from racist people.  bigots aren't a protected or vulnerable class and being a bigot is not an immovable part of a person's identity
disagree,

lol
Title: Re: tupac dealing final blow to War2
Post by: Lambchops on October 25, 2018, 09:29:55 AM
OK first I'd like to say that I'm not one to point the finger at anyone else for the quality or style of their unpaid volunteer/hobby activities. I'm aware that even low levels of admin/event event co-ordination etc. can take up a large amount of your personal time. I'm glad there is anywhere left we can all play WC2 and thank anyone volunteering their time and effort to that end. I certainly don't have the time or personal resources to run a server so I'm  glad there are still people who do.

:D idk man, it seems facile to reduce all ru's problems to the fact that it gives toxic people an equal right to use the server. there's so many other factors at play......

Well THB really don't think the war2.ru has a lot of problems at all:

Moron attacks aside, it has a reliable server that is almost never down, a nice stable easily installed client, a great website with lots of interesting stuff (plus the russian site which I can't understand but looks to have some cool features and a community), it has an active and technically reliable forum, discord, twitch, the status page is great, and 99 times out of 100 it all basically does what it should. Yes I agree a PvPGN update might be nice, but really the old battle.net system pretty much is-what-it-is.

The issue I see is one of one of the community. There are simply fewer and fewer people playing. There's players who love and play the game actively leaving, and really hardly any genuine newbies to speak of.

I myself have occasionally spent time playing stupid little ad-ridden browser games etc. Every day there are millions of bored people clicking of their web-browsers looking for something to play, but the few that end up here don't seem to stay long. Why not?

The best situation for a healthy server that is sustainable or even growing is that it should ALWAYS have some noobs, which means that there would also be noobs playing all the time.

That's right ... noobs in YOUR games! ... All the time! ... put one on each team and get them playing. Every single game. This would be perfect situation, but right now there aren't enough noobs to go round.

A balanced game with some good and some new players is a PRO GAME with a good host.

8 people constantly joining one game while 2 or 4 people play and the rest watch .... WTH? go make another game, if you're lucky you might get some noobs to join too!

   ..... personally, i also like the non-hypocrisy of allowing everyone the opportunity to play here. the modern mindset treats "toxic" people as if they are lesser human beings and takes great pleasure in ridiculing, shunning & ejecting them from on or offline communities. well, that's exactly the same thing that bigots are being shunned & rejected for doing, so how does that make sense? all this does is segregate human beings into two opposed populations that are constantly at each other's throats....

I absolutely want the toxic people to play. I would never see any group of people leaving the game as at all desirable. I want everyone to play. We are the community ... all of us that are still playing. The community isn't anyone's idea of what it should be, it is the people, it's us.

IMHO the cohesion and permiability of this group is the most important and pretty much only major issue with the game- server- whatever.

I firmly believe that there IS a happy medium where all of us can co-exist, attract new players, and enjoy the game, and when anyone ... really ANYONE ... for whatever reason, decides to leave the community it is a big FAIL and LOSE for us all.

I generally try to be civil when I'm playing, but over the years I have sometimes got into arguments with people - I have hurled abuse - I have sent nasty messages, raged, BSed and been a fully toxic dick. It happens. But we ALL should just be a tiny bit aware that we actually want people to play this game, yes even the one's you don't like, and not be SO nasty that they leave.

Just use some common sense. There are always going to be people you don't like in any group. Just talk normally to them when you have to - for procedural stuff or whatever, but apart from that just leave them alone. Grown-ups do that ffs.

For those few brain-damaged permenantly toxic children, I think it's up to the rest of us - amins, players, whatever, just all of us - to let them know by whatever means available when they are way over the line and should pull their heads in.

Regardless of what anyone's personal philosopy is on anything, the fact is that by any means: making people leave the community is damaging the group and therefore doing the wrong thing by the community.


These things would indicate that the situation has damaged the community. The exact correct/most desirable path may be a subject for opinion and arbitration but the fact that it lies somewhere in between these extremes is IMHO undeniable.


...... i doubt that, people who have played here for 10 years aren't going to just quit because they couldn't log in a few times. minor week-to-week fluctuations are hardly anything to go by

Definately not. I don't think the bot attacks made any real difference to anything, they're just a symptom or the underlying tension in the community that IS having an effect... I think we had better turn that chill in the air into the teensy little wake-up call and all just start leaning a bit in the realistic direction.

Whatever the atmosphere in our community is, there sure isn't a line of new people waiting to get in.

Awesome game.  Great sever.  So why not?