Author Topic: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing  (Read 26856 times)

Offline Winchester

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #90 on: December 28, 2020, 08:57:35 PM »
  it exists in the form of "Queueing" in just about every RTS except for War2.

War2 has Queueing too, its just not in the PC version, in the playstation version of the game, you can queue up to 99 of each unit, you also get to select 16 units instead of the usual 9 in that too. There may be a few other things in it i forgot, but those 2 really stood out.
 


Offline Certified MENSA Genius Brain (smart)

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #91 on: December 28, 2020, 09:52:06 PM »
Glad all this stuff would be map dependent.  Things like rally points cut into the one thing that sets War2 apart from every other RTS out there,  the requirement of multi-tasking for every single minor detail.  The more you automate,  the more watered down multi-tasking skills become.  Something as minor as forgetting to make peons do something like chop or mine can determine who's going to win and who isnt and that's the way it should be.  What's next?  Automatic creation of peons?  Dont laugh,  it exists in the form of "Queueing" in just about every RTS except for War2.  And the idea of units fighting on the way to a path already exists in the game.  It's called patrol.  Always patrol to a spot on the map,  then know how long it's going to take them to get there and stop them once they arrive.  That's a critical part of war2 and can also determine who's going to win and who isnt.  Those who pay attention to minor details are always going to have the upper hand in war2.  In every other RTS,  minor details mean jack squat because they simply dont exist due to all the automation.  If I wanted to play SC/SC2/AoE and watch the CPU basically play for me in 75% of the game,  I'd go play SC/SC2/AoE,  I wouldnt play war2.
Don’t get me wrong, I don’t want all this stuff to replace war2 as we know it, but it would be very interesting to see and play around using. Esp if it’s just based on a map, then it’s like hosting a weird game with Use Map Settings and we can all chill on the same server. Would be fun to play GOW with all these changes like Daemons and strong archers, but would also be fun to play GOW with rally points and improved pathfinding etc in the same place we can also play the original way.
    

Offline iL

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #92 on: December 29, 2020, 03:29:41 AM »
For now its like A-click.
Would be great to make it similar to right-click,
to find how right-click being handled and apply it when unit appears trained from building.
To let war2 logic handle that, not your reimplementation
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Offline iL

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #93 on: December 29, 2020, 03:34:55 AM »
Glad all this stuff would be map dependent.  Things like rally points cut into the one thing that sets War2 apart from every other RTS out there,  the requirement of multi-tasking for every single minor detail.  The more you automate,  the more watered down multi-tasking skills become.  Something as minor as forgetting to make peons do something like chop or mine can determine who's going to win and who isnt and that's the way it should be.  What's next?  Automatic creation of peons?  Dont laugh,  it exists in the form of "Queueing" in just about every RTS except for War2.  And the idea of units fighting on the way to a path already exists in the game.  It's called patrol.  Always patrol to a spot on the map,  then know how long it's going to take them to get there and stop them once they arrive.  That's a critical part of war2 and can also determine who's going to win and who isnt.  Those who pay attention to minor details are always going to have the upper hand in war2.  In every other RTS,  minor details mean jack squat because they simply dont exist due to all the automation.  If I wanted to play SC/SC2/AoE and watch the CPU basically play for me in 75% of the game,  I'd go play SC/SC2/AoE,  I wouldnt play war2.
As for me, it's absolute priority for me to keep the original war2 untouthed.
Everything Mistral works on in this plugin is fine, but it will be just an option.
My main concept: war2 should be the same as default.
If Mistral/Oragorn will be able to find followers for that war2mod gameplay, it will be an option implemented, though i'd be happy to have that also. But original game will be on.

We even changed backup server behavior to the original game by default.
If people want to play mod, all of them should join from "War2Mod" channel. That will gaurantee everybody knows what they want to play.
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Offline Oragorn

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #94 on: December 29, 2020, 07:25:34 AM »
To begin with, everyone needs to understand that no one is going to delete the old ordinary Warcraft2 anywhere! We ourselves dearly love and appreciate him. Believe me.
Secondly, I am firmly convinced that ordinary custom maps will not bring much benefit and will not be popular even in the long term.
That is why War2mod was born.
Agree, you have created a set of triggers for the classic gow map? Played a couple of times. And suddenly you wanted to try the same set of triggers, but on a different map. You will have to use the program again and create the same triggers as for the gow map.
I offer something else: a certain set of triggers, which will ALREADY be set on a permanent basis. (Of course, we with the team, and also with your help, want to make this set of triggers the most interesting and balanced.) This is done for the convenience of the players. And as a user, I understand that it is MORE CONVENIENT for people than creating another custom map every time.
No, I agree that the Mistral program itself will be very useful. For example, to create your own campaign, or for a really dumb simple custom map.
But in my understanding, taking into account many factors, among which lies the usual laziness (excuse me, I judge for myself) - it is much easier and faster to implement this in war2mod.
Now about the organization of the project itself:
It is supposed to implement war2mod as an additional mode (picture attached).
OR, implement it as now - on an additional channel, such as (war2bne, truvia, russia, etc).

Also, I apologize for causing you inconvenience during the bot attack of some freaks. We did not take this factor into account when we put the war2mod on an additional server.
But now, for the test period, the war2mod is placed on another channel of the additional server. (not main)
_____
The attentive reader will find war2balance among the new types.
This project goes alongside war2mod - there will be a minimum of new useful things so as not to spoil the atmosphere of "that same war2", but the race (alliance and horde) will be balanced.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2020, 07:55:16 AM by Oragorn »

Offline Mistral

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #95 on: December 30, 2020, 03:34:53 PM »
Ok new update.

Now not needed to stand paladins near church to enable autoheal.
instead of it now there is new button in church that enables/disables autoheal.

Offline Certified MENSA Genius Brain (smart)

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #96 on: January 01, 2021, 11:49:30 PM »
Any thoughts as to adding unit queuing and improved pathfinding?

Would it be possible?

These are the things (in addition to rally points) that would make War2 "modern" and I'm super curious if it's possible
    

Offline Mistral

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #97 on: January 02, 2021, 01:57:32 AM »
queuing no, there is no memory in unit to store queue.
in war2 dark saga from PS1 there was autobuild. not really queues but close. and they specially added new union of bytes in unit structure for this. but i cannot do this. they have done this cause they had source code.
pathfinding maybe if just fix a little. there is not much to improve.
if u want to making pathfinding really normal then easier wiil be to write new algoritms than try to fix bugged shit that game have now.
but i cannot create new. There is too much and too hard.

Offline Certified MENSA Genius Brain (smart)

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #98 on: January 04, 2021, 10:00:56 AM »
I actually don't care about unit queuing, was just wondering though, thinking it would help attract modern players spoiled by such things :D

pathfinding improvement would be super cool... but does sound like a big job
    

Offline ~ToRa~

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #99 on: January 04, 2021, 01:13:16 PM »
I actually don't care about unit queuing, was just wondering though, thinking it would help attract modern players spoiled by such things :D

pathfinding improvement would be super cool... but does sound like a big job

I like the idea of unit queueing to.
But u know our playerbase would lose their shit if we added that mod lmao.
war2 > war3

Offline Certified MENSA Genius Brain (smart)

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #100 on: January 04, 2021, 04:00:37 PM »
Well it wouldn't be installed server-wide, only in the triggered puds or w/e

Personally, it's a microtask I think is a fun kind of challenge instead of just a frustration.  Pathfinding is more of a frustration.  I mean you can kind of learn the multi-step moves you might have to send guys on to get them to a particular location without being stuck but that seems way more like... should you have to??  That seems more like something that's just not working, whereas unit queues seem more like an extra feature
« Last Edit: January 04, 2021, 04:05:43 PM by Certified MENSA Genius Brain (smart) »
    

Offline Mistral

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #101 on: January 18, 2021, 01:22:39 AM »
New update.

1)Created new trigger that allow change game speed in multiplayer game. (this thing was in old IPX but now broken in BNE so i just fixed Blizzard code).
So you will be able to use this trigger for like maybe play on fastest when first TH and farm builds then you change speed to EF or lower to play normally and make some super micro control pro players game.
So this thing enabled in War2Mod by default so you can go and test. (please test and say what you think cause it will be removed later)

2) Real OBS trigger.
So now in war2mod when you set your race to "Random" (not Human and not Orc) you will be OBS.
So when game starts all obs units got destroyed, but you still not kicked from game and stay.
And all players give him viz automatically (comps too).
So you can just relax and observ this game and not interfere. (now you cannot do this even if you want cause you not have any units).
So now no more shitty obses who builds base in corner of map or do something other bad things with his starting peon.

So this all already on backup server, just go and test/play.
Second server in list is backup server (named: "if server is down").
And you must go to channel War2Mod for triggers to activate.

Offline Szwagier

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #102 on: January 18, 2021, 03:23:58 AM »
what if someone want play random? he wont be in game?
http://www.youtube.com/user/SzwagierR


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Offline Mistral

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #103 on: January 18, 2021, 06:25:59 AM »
He will be obs ))
for now at least.
maybe will be changed later.

Offline Paper_Boy

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Re: War2Mod (War2 with triggers) beta testing
« Reply #104 on: March 04, 2021, 03:02:55 AM »
Well Done! I love all the new ideas

If you’re making small tweaks.



Slow should have greater range so its easier to mage Bomb!

EXorcism and Unholy armor should be a little cheaper.

Skeletons little cheaper & faster so they can rape Farmed in dks

Casting Flame shield on fliers

Could Jugs move on land as a Howitzer?

Allow a Church at Hold so humans aren’t at a disadvantage until Fort stage?

Perhaps no auto heal until Fort?



At some point could Random be made into a 3rd race incorporating Sc2 Characters?