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Messages - Cel

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1 / Re: Why doesn't everyone move to GOG?
« on: February 15, 2022, 04:47:56 AM »
I believe there is only one divide not 3, the only separation I see is ru / usa because there is bad blood between you guys and both side antagonizes the other.

Trog does not antagonize people and does not care where people come from or will go after his stream is over. There is no divide, just a common ground where people just meet and play a game they love with people they respect and feel respected by.

If anything Trog's "community" is a bridge, not yet another airtight wall. Because it allows people that were not meeting otherwise, to play together and create new friendships.

There will always be more than one place to play wc2. Question is, does it always have to be a matter of us against them.  :beam:


2 / Re: Why doesn't everyone move to GOG?
« on: February 14, 2022, 07:11:47 AM »
GOG is NOT a better experience. Yes it does not lag that much, but you certainly cannot get or even dream of lan latency there, it just is the way it was in 2000. Actually the whole game really is just like it was back then, without all the care and love people gave it here over the years.
That said I think IL finally implemented the server protection I recommended a year ago, right @iL ? If that is the case and I could make a difference I am really glad. I believe it still may take a few tweaks / time to get it perfectly right though so be patient but once it is, the server wont suffer this kind of crap anymore unless the attackers spends way more from their pockets which is just always satisfying to know  :ok_hand:.

About Trogallart and his stream.
Maybe Trog just still likes and enjoys the good old and flawed game he plays with his people over there. Maybe not all of these nice players that come play with him feel like playing on RU yet or at all. And maybe he values the people he plays with more than the game itself.
What if some of these new guys happen to learn a thing or two about the game, get hooked, and end up wanting to play here too sometimes? What if the nice people they met that came from RU happen to be a perfect introduction to play here later surrounded by friendly faces?

Who said it always had to be about choosing a camp or standing a ground? No matter where people play and how people enjoy it wc2 is wc2, I do not think we need to create yet another divide where we do not need to have one. Just play where you want with the people you want to play with...

What Trog is building is just a group of friends, that respect each others, and that he has fun playing with and looks forward to be around every weekend. That is it...

The fact that GOG is being used at all and that we can annoy Blizzard every time they mess up is just a free added benefit.
But seriously moving players from RU to GOG I cannot see how that would have a good effect at all, except maybe it would just manage to push even more players that still enjoy the game on RU to stop playing altogether which would be just a net loss for everyone.

That said, happy gaming! bye! :wave: :wc2:

3 / Re: Controversial "utube channel" thread stickied?
« on: November 26, 2020, 01:53:13 AM »
Xurnt is the man. We love you too, tora and cel, but burnt and tk are the shiznat. Fuck you dugs, you're ok too guess. Don't care who you are oculus but we are very fond of our imperfect admins.

The guy has one point though, I am not admin and certainly have no interest in being one here.
I just happen to have some of the admins ears and some actually listen to what I say which hopefully is great though it means I cant promise anything. It is all none of my ressort.

What I am seeing is very clear though and on this point alone I agree:
War2 is a very old game and we do not have many people left that still love and play the game. is yet still the place that most players come to play it. But it obviously has flaws big flaws and one of them is toxicity in the community.

Obvisously with no clear rules in place a few people are not even trying to keep the experience fun or safe for one-another which in the end taints everything else.
No rules mean there are only a few place that are actually nice to hangout in for normal human beings, where there is not always an argument going on or whatever.
The worst part is that it is not even representative of the community as a whole, all the hatred and all the crap only comes from a handful of people. Yet everyone gets to see it, all the time everywhere, like if it represented 80% of the server population when in reality it is more like 1%.

And it does not even matter at this point if people are rightfully accused or not or whatever, it just is not the place...
No one wants to read people insulting each other all the time when joining a gaming forum or community about a game they love.
This is why most forums out there do not allow such endless shit to take place in the first place.
Let alone rely solely on their admins judgement for every single decisions regarding very common offenses.

Rules should exist that makes decisions predictable and a lot less reliant on admins judgement, this both means easier adminship and more generally accepted ruling and fairer / cleaner place for everyone.

It is about time that we adopt a few if not all of the community guidelines of Blizzard to try and make a better place for everyone.
A place where we care about one-another and where everyone has to show a little bit of respect to members, not much, just enough not to piss everyone off so much that you get reported all the time for being an asshole.

Rules that will ensure we are not letting a handful of toxic weirdos behave like monkeys and push away decent people that love to game too...

In the end if that place happen to get some decent commonly accepted basic rules, I am pretty sure most if not all members will adapt to them just fine.
It does not mean admins will have to go out of their way to apply them all the time it means when people have complaints or something is done wrong they do not have to rely as much on their own judgement to take action...

All of that leads to fairer ruling and friendlier environement for everyone without over-doing it and going full LGBTW or whatever about it...

Now like I said I cannot promise this is what will be decided in the end by the guys in charge in the end, but this is what I have been trying to push them to go for. Because all of this would stop for good.

From my perspective I haven't seen proof enough that admins are corrupt, all I see is some of them are sometimes acting without guidelines on personal feelings.
Some of them also said things to make points that clearly were not thought through. But from where I stand most of them try to do the job.
That includes banning hate-speech, copy pasted topics and spamming etc... What makes it so much about them is the absence of rules...

Bare in mind that in Blizzard forums calling out or attacking publicly another member, let alone admins, is completely not allowed.
No matter who you are and how true your claims may be they are not allowing it.
They keep these accusations in a very different place not even in the forums to keep their forums and games as friendly as possible.

An interesting take for sure of the whole problem when you think about it :P

4 / Re: Controversial "utube channel" thread stickied?
« on: November 25, 2020, 07:38:49 PM »
I totally agree with point 1) though it is long overdue trash removal...

Also rules finally are coming to the forum from what my pinkie told me.

So these posts you are talking about wont ever happen anymore either which is a very good thing! And guess what made it possible:

Last time such rules were proposed Equinox and Burnt were amongst the only ones that voted against having some rules againt hate speech and racism or harrasment on the forum  :rofl:

So dont worry, change is coming now that they wont be able to stop it, rules are coming big time! :ok_hand:

This is for reference:,5378.0.html

Rules that are coming will be much more detailled though and completely in the line of rules you can find anywhere else on the web. No more bullying no more harrassement no more hate speech...

Gold Mine / Re: wc2 utube channel
« on: November 24, 2020, 01:01:01 PM »
Nice work exposing Blid and Tora as liars.  Cel should be a admin and remove Tora and blid.  Let’s have a vote.
Well although I could not totally clear Blid then because I hadn't checked IPs locations yet. I just did, and actually neither Derber, Blid, Jordan and Thumb$ used VPNs that night. They all played from different states. Not even mentioning Thumb$ who was playing from a completely different country.

As for Tora I dont know if he lied or not when he said Jordan switched IPs with derber in the past.
Because like I said I only got to check that time frame from july to september and so maybe it happened further in the past and I would not be able to tell.
All I can say is from these log files in that game Angel was using his own IP and 00Jordanus was in fact Thumb$ and Derber logged after Thumb$ logged in as 00Jordanus.

And please no, I dont want to be admin I am just trying to help people see this through the best I can because it has to stop somehow...

Also @van the logs say you could have seen Blid right before the game with Thumb$ playing as 00Jordanus happened, is this your recollection of what happened? Or are you 100% sure you saw him after that game?

If Van is sure he saw it after the game not before then the question becomes: is there a known client buffering that could explain the client saving the state of the channel and just showing it back up when you return to the channel after a game before it updates? In which case it could be just that, otherwise it is Van's word vs IL's word pretty much at this point which sucks...

Gold Mine / Re: wc2 utube channel
« on: November 24, 2020, 12:19:45 PM »
Recording peoples whispers has NEVER been brought up. This news needs to be spread.

Like I said it totally is not news.
All games that have some kind of moderation do it and that is a good way to catch pedophiles amongst other things.
At least IL keeps your whispers from admins unless some really big shit happens in which case he just digs out the time period where the stuff we want to check happened.
Most games will just make a tool for admins to look at anyone's messages on the fly whenever they want with ease.
Name any MMO or popular game that has dedicated servers and you can bet they do it...

Gold Mine / Re: wc2 utube channel
« on: November 24, 2020, 12:07:10 PM »
@XuRnT Everything you send to whatever server or site out there is logged with your IP.
No matter what server you connect to, this is why some people use VPN to stay anonymous sometimes when they visit sites they are not too proud of  :rofl:.
Some companies like google are very very effective at tracking your every move on internet that way.
The fact is, logs are kept on the filesystem of the server in most cases and help for many things including detecting attacks but also in these situations, understand what happened on the site/server to better handle problems.

Just like server security it usually is better the less people have access to them and are often never checked because it litterally take ages to parse through them if you do not know what you are looking for. In that case one game and discussions from players in that very small timeframe and even that took me 2 days...
On IL is the only one to have access to these logs and to the filesystem, he only sent me the part where the issue happened and in that situation I think it was the right thing to do if it could help bring closure to the whole drama...

At this point not knowing was doing more harm than having the facts layed out for good...

Oh and if you have played WOW let me tell you admins had access to litterally every personal messages you sent even more quickly and easily through the game interface itself. And I bet they did not stop there the new Bnet for SC2 and Reforget probably also have these features and more. Logs in new games are much much more looked into than since even if there is annoying drama constantly on that forum it barely ever reaches that far  that IL has to take out the shovel...
Congrats you succeeded in forcing iL to dig out the trash  :clap: :clap: :clap:

That hopefully will never happen again but you never know what the future holds...

Gold Mine / Re: wc2 utube channel
« on: November 24, 2020, 02:41:10 AM »
Oh and BTW Thumb$ later appologized to Jordan saying he totally believe to have lost to Viruz playing under Xurnt's name but nope logs are very very formal...

He lost to Xurnt...

No doubt to that at all on this side, since he hosted the game the logs are 100% clear for Xurnt... So the truth is Xurnt totally sat on Thumb$ 's face that night, and Viruz had nothing to do with it or anyone else for that matter... The way I see it, Thumb$ just tried to bite larger than he could chew  :rofl:...

The thing is, this stupid drama and horrible never ending :poo: has been plaguing the forum and the community for a year and a half now and it also has been pushing players away...

It was a freaking mess, and it should never happen again...

Rules and better management of  the server will certainly make sure of that...

Gold Mine / Re: wc2 utube channel
« on: November 24, 2020, 12:58:28 AM »
OK I was about to ask IL's logs back to check on something. Turns out I didnt need to I could still get them.
I didn't want to check on messages but at somepoint you have to as I wanted to see what started it all.
Because I know Burnt can be a dickhead sometimes but still...
The IP connections events happen separately than the login event so I could say for sure that the IP of Jordan connected before derber logged off and Jordan did connect at that time, and just before the aka was logged in but I had to check for someone else IP that I wasn't prepared for. Fortunately reading the messaged this time was pretty quick I did not have to read a lot to find this:

Aug 27 06:42:08 [info ] handle_command: [18] user 'thumb$' cmd: "/whisper derber van is on xurnt name rofl , Brb"
Aug 27 21:35:28 [info ] handle_command: [31] user 'thumb$' cmd: "/whisper 00Jordanus give me ur pasw i will kick him so bad lol"
Aug 27 21:35:43 [info ] handle_command: [29] user '00Jordanus' cmd: "/whisper thumb$ u wnat?"
Aug 27 21:35:44 [info ] handle_command: [29] user '00Jordanus' cmd: "/whisper thumb$ pw is ****"
Aug 27 21:35:46 [info ] handle_command: [29] user '00Jordanus' cmd: "/whisper thumb$ go rape him"
Aug 27 21:35:50 [info ] handle_command: [31] user 'thumb$' cmd: "/r sure "
Aug 27 21:36:01 [info ] conn_destroy: [31] "thumb$" logged out
Aug 27 21:36:03 [info ] conn_destroy: [29] "00Jordanus" logged out
Aug 27 21:36:03 [info ] sd_accept: [29] accepted connection from IPOFTHUMBS (he is using VPN)
Aug 27 21:36:04 [info ] sd_accept: [29] accepted connection from IPOFJORDAN (same IP as always)
Aug 27 21:36:13 [info ] _client_loginreq1: [31] "00jordanus" logged in (correct password)
Aug 27 21:36:22 [info ] conn_destroy: [60] "derber" logged out <== Derber logged out after. And no one logged in before the game started from there.

So no it wasn't Swift / Derber, that I triple checked, but it does look like there was something fishy here non the less. And I do owe Xurnt some appology since I had only checked his version of the facts first and didn't dig more after that. I should have obviously but in my mind it was either he is right or he is wrong turns out he was onto something here...

So who is Thumb$?

And at this point I am not an admin I dont care if you think it is not right to reveal part of these logs too much damage has been done in our community not to just go forward with the truth.
I was only trusted to be unbiaised which I am, so here it is when I find something I say it...
This has been dragged for far too loooong now and we need closure and the truth to come out, it is not ok to let Xurnt go completely crazy mad like this and not come forward to try and make things right...

So yes the logs contradicted Xurnt's version for sure, but he was not playing Jordanus either and he could at least feel that...
As a matter of fact it seems that account sharing is a thing here apparently and messing with other people's mind too.
So what do you guys plan to do about it? Is it an accepted thing here? @~ToRa~ @iL @tk[as] ?

And why did Thumb$ not just come clean about it and not let Xurnt grow crazier and crazier over it to the point he thought people were burning his grass?

To be fair this is probably the only thing that is true about Xurnt's version of the facts, Xurnt was not playing against Jordan that night...
I appologize for not finding out faster...
I am pissed that I did not read these messages before... I really thought I didn't need to because logs showed Swift/Derber was not there...

Xurnt may have become paranoid and start seing ghosts on top of that after a while but at least it didn't come out from thin air. He is not that stupid, he had good reasons to start doubting initialy at least... I hope this helps bring closure to the whole shitshow at somepoint in a near future and at least unfreeze a few tongues in the time being...

Gold Mine / Re: wc2 utube channel
« on: November 23, 2020, 11:14:08 PM »
Aug 27 06:25:25 [info ] conn_set_game: [53] game [32469] "jordan wants one more" (pass "") host "IPOFDERBER", mapsize 256x256, maxplayers 8, speed 0(unknown), maptype 2(Blizzard), gametype 3(melee), tileset 0(Unknown) map "Garden of War.pud", created by "derber"

your games started to happen around 2-3 am where the "Jordan wants one more" game happened and you guys played all the way until the one game happened where indeed we can see in the log:

Aug 27 21:36:02 [info ] game_create: game "dw" (pass "dw") type 3(melee) startver 4 created <=== This is when you create your game where you think Jordan was Swift. (so after Blid logged out)

Aug 27 21:36:03 [info ] conn_destroy: [29] "00Jordanus" logged out
Aug 27 21:36:13 [info ] _client_loginreq1: [31] "00jordanus" logged in (correct password)

he did relog with minor cases nickname prolly because he typed it fast because the IP is the same both times, like I said in the whole log files all these accounts never shared IPs.

This is what the logs said as I reported to IL after browsing them myself... All in all it does not matter when the game was played anyways because the only thing that matters here is the IPS simply do not match ever from July to september.
Not once has the IP of derber/swift been seen on Jordan's aka or the other way around... Not once...

Gold Mine / Re: wc2 utube channel
« on: November 23, 2020, 10:27:31 PM »
Another funny part of your guys story is Blid says he logged in before the incident, and Cel claims he logged in after. Make up your minds. Van saw you log in right after.

If you actually read what people say... People said he connected like he said during the early afternoon that day... Your game was 3am in the morning, Blid login happened 1:35pm the same day...

Gold Mine / Re: wc2 utube channel
« on: November 23, 2020, 10:13:40 PM »
The fact that it happened before if it did, further proves the non-sense that this whole sharade is...

Swift or Jordan or anyone is not going to be going that far just to prove someone didn't loose in a 25 years old game...
Swift didnt do it back then, and logs show him and Jordan have not done it then. Why would they anyways, like you said it happened before and no one cares about it more than Burnt...

The logs show Swift was connected at the time of the game behind the same IP he always used, and Jordan was  connected in that game with the ip Jordan always used too.
In the whole log file not once have one IP been shared between any of the blid/derber/jordan accounts none...
So it does not matter what Tora said then because even if they did share account at some point in their lifetime which they categorically denied, it simply did not happen during that period of time from july to september. Not once in the whole log file ever...

Or you seriously believe that all the admins including IL are all completely going out of their way to cover up for Swift's loss under Jordan's account and for what?
No one cares as much as Burnt does...

None of these accusations make any sense and everyone knows it...
People that keep saying what Burnt wants to hear, because they fear to anger him are obviously not helping him. But at this point it is not my problem...

I dont know what made Burnt so bitter and angry about these two guys in the first place but something happened, and it has nothing to do with them hacking or whatever machiavelous plans involving them playing on each other's accounts.

And frankly at this point, it doesn't matter... This whole stupid and destructive war will stop soon, and the drama will be gone with it...  :slight_smile:

Gold Mine / Re: wc2 utube channel
« on: November 23, 2020, 08:29:00 PM »
Lets resume briefly Mr Burnt's position:

Logs that no one have access to except for IL are "tempered" and cannot be trusted.
What every single admin said once they started digging is wrong and cannot be trusted.
But what a friend of Burnt said, which he later admitted was just to cheer him up, before he started investigating is "Hard evidence". Because it could be compatible with part of his theory...

Here is the truth:

Van didn't lie I believe he saw blid yes, just about 9 hours after the games were played as it is backed up by the logs...
There is nothing that would have pushed anyone to log in as Blid if it was only to "cover tracks" or "check if it was covered" like Burnt said.
You dont need to connect to the game to check the ladder, or to change data on any database you have access to and even Burnt knows it.
The ladder is not even at the same place that the pvpgn server is, yet Burnt keeps saying Blid has to be in the mix because he connected that night and this only makes sense to him...

None of the facts are "hard evidence" to Burnt when they dont back up his fantasy.
His version of what happened has to be the right one and anyone that does not ride along with Burnt is part of a growing conspiracy against him,
or is stupid because they dont acknowledge his clear hard evident hear says.

If Burnt knew he had actually beaten or could beat Swift in a fair 1v1, he probably wouldn't cry about one game as he could just win again next time or move on.
So he is also lying to himself and would rather believe people would go to these crazy length just to cover one loss from Swift than accept the truth.

In conclusion:

Burnt never cared if anything was true, all he ever wanted is to hurt these two other guys no matter what and everything that stood in his way to that end...
Because he was probably pissed about them even before the games started, that is what I now believe...

If you want Burnt to consider you a friend dont ever tell him what you think but stick to what he wants to hear.

Here are the positives we get from the whole shit show:

Everyone saw right through Burnt but himself. And finally things are about to change for the better here because of that. :newthumbsup:

There will be a new channel for youtube it is being discussed as we speak, I for one think having a list clearly visible on the site will be a better solution yet not mutually exclusive in the long run. It may help also attract other content creators too.

All that stupid drama made us discover all these cool other war2 related youtube channels and we will certainly make something great out of that too :slight_smile:

These situations probably wont ever happen again and a handfull of toxic/negative people will no longer be able to occupy 80% of the space in the forums and game with their drama.
Let alone impose their will on others by acting like thug lords.

War2 has a much much brighter future ahead, it sadly had to get worse before it gets better  8)  :wc2:

Gold Mine / Re: wc2 utube channel
« on: November 20, 2020, 08:46:52 PM »
Oh I understand completely ::) :-\

Gold Mine / Re: wc2 utube channel
« on: November 20, 2020, 07:22:08 PM »
Not that it changes much for the connections that night since Xurnt believes he played against swift that night and not 00Jordanus but.

What makes/made you and Mousey think @~ToRa~ that Blid and Jordan where sharing accounts?
Or that Blid shared all the access with Jordan? Is there evidence of that somewhere or it was educated speculations based on your understanding of the person?
I mean technically at this point if Blid was playing under 00Jordanus account he could have connected through a vpn just to make the ban under blid's name but still.
These 3 players were connected at the same time from 3 different IPS at one point so.
At least for that very few hours frametime if the logs are legit they were not doing it, and actually in that whole file for the 5 accounts 00Jordanus played on none ever connected with a different IP.

If you think they did share at some point and remember vaguely the time it happened maybe IL could have a look but I wont waste more time on it honestly, I watsted too much time already as it is.

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